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airbagit13
27th June 2011, 02:46 PM
Ok so I am using a 10x7 prop on my Maxi Swift, she flys perfect normally but if I dive she wants to torque roll to the left sometimes. I try to fight it by giving right aileron but its to strong and I have to let it flip me over then come out of it inverted.

This happened to me 3 times in 1 flight. All three of them are on video below. Any idea what could be causing this?


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2uSNkqquQP8&feature=mfu_in_order&list=UL

Greg
27th June 2011, 03:41 PM
I just shat myself a little bit.

My fiance wants to thank you for also soiling my pants when you almost nailed the electricity pole (missed it by inches)

marcin.gala
27th June 2011, 06:21 PM
You got to much CG behind rear limit Negative stability.

Tuppertn
27th June 2011, 06:50 PM
Did you have to trim in a bunch of left elevon in level flight to compensate for the motor torque or gear placement? If that's the case then when you build airspeed in a dive, especially with the motor off, it'll want to roll left.

kendall

Greg
27th June 2011, 07:34 PM
Its not trim. he is compensating for the roll with input to surfaces.

airbagit13
27th June 2011, 07:39 PM
Yeah level flight was not to much of a problem, I think my right aileron is like 1/4 an inch higher then my left at level trim. I flew a second flight that day with smaller batteries which cut some weight from the nose and she seemed to fly a bit better but she still rolled if I went into a dive to fast. (as Greg experienced while riding passenger)

I didnt check to dive with the motor off which I probably should have.

Not posting it here to get views for the contest but here she is for the majority of the time:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TkLOra1jpWE&feature=mfu_in_order&list=U (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TkLOra1jpWE)

She flies great, its only when I dive or dive and turn left at the same time that she rolls.

Greg
27th June 2011, 07:45 PM
Not posting it here to get views for the contest but here she is for the majority of the time:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TkLOra1jpWE&feature=mfu_in_order&list=U (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TkLOra1jpWE)



You link failed like the Titanic's maiden voyage.

Greg
27th June 2011, 07:46 PM
lol..you caught it before i hit quote.

airbagit13
27th June 2011, 08:18 PM
lol

Adrenalinrush
27th June 2011, 09:06 PM
I have been talking with airbag about the exact same problem. I ordered and built a Maxi a couple of weeks ago too and have an issue where the ridge along the span is not flat on one side, and flat on the other. I think it was a packaging issue where one foam wing was strapped to another one. It could be a number of things though. I know I have my CG right because I tried it at 290,300,310,320,330.340 and 315 is the sweet spot for me atm. But it still has 1/4-1/2 deflection in one of the ailerons to keep it "level". Which I still have to give it some right stick. (I think right)

Im just frustrated!

marcin.gala
27th June 2011, 09:17 PM
Place your finger on maxi nose and another on engine shaft at the end "lift"...see what's happen then...which wing left/right is more heavy..that's also important.

airbagit13
27th June 2011, 09:20 PM
Yeah I made sure that both of my wings balance out. Its perfectly balanced in the center.

Adrenaline I was going to PM you but I took a straight edge to my wings and my right wings airfoil is perfectly straight and my left wing humps up a little in the middle. I don't think it would be enough to really perfect performance though.

Greg
27th June 2011, 11:59 PM
Chad, depends.

Aerodynamics works in funny ways. Think about how a plane self levels just from dihedral.

not saying this is the issue, but a quick illustration.
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/d/df/SK_Dihedral_3.png

The lower wing has a greater amount of lift.

so on your wing... aiming down and gaining enough speed, the angle of attack where the hump is might make it roll... maybe.

I would play with your CG first.

Do the normal CG checks.
Trim for level glide.
Power off, dive at 30deg.
Watch the plane LOS to see if it pulls out or tucks in.

It should slowly recover on its own.
1681

Adrenalinrush
28th June 2011, 05:17 AM
I put a push pin in the nose and hold the spinner on the motor, its level...

I don't believe the dihedral is off, the cord is level all the way around where they join.

marcin.gala
28th June 2011, 08:25 AM
How you guys glue maxi..using bottom or top when do the halfs on table??
Be honest ..;-)

IBCrazy
28th June 2011, 08:28 AM
Usually flying wings roll when overloaded. What happens is one wingtip stalls before the other resulting in a roll. Often this happens in the direction opposite the prop rotation (I believe the torque of the prop loads up one side a bit causing it to stall early).

There are a few things you can do:

Add a mid wing stabilizer on both sides. Basically make another set of winglets about halfway down (or a little further) down the wing. This will help not only stabilize the plane, but also limit the stall from rolling out at low speeds. be sure that the winglets have sufficient surface area both above and below the wing. 2" above and below the wing (for a total of 4-5") is usually sufficient.

You can also add supports (ie carbon rods). This will keep the wing from flexing and oscillating. While this doesn't prevent low speed tip stalls, it will minimize high speed stalls.

-Alex

Greg
28th June 2011, 11:52 AM
Alex, he wasnt flying slow. it was a fast dive with power on.

Adrenalinrush
28th June 2011, 11:55 AM
I glued mine upside down "wing bottom up". Thats how the directions have it.

Mine isn't torque rolling, but I haven't had it in a steep dive yet either. Just trimming it out power off, I have to get one aileron up 1/2 in

airbagit13
28th June 2011, 12:09 PM
Yup on a few of the flips I was going slow but one particular case which wasn't recorded but Greg saw I was diving down like 100 feet at almost full throttle. I flipped like 20-30 feet up missing a light pole and power lines by a few inches. how I recovered I will never know.

I dont remember how I glued mine, up or down. I think I was holding it vertically and lining it up visually. Regardless it came out very straight.

Greg
28th June 2011, 12:10 PM
this might sound dumb...but why would you trim a single aileron?

when doing all these tests and trimming... remember that you will always have different effects at different speeds. you can trim and balance for slow or fast flight, not both. it can be done so that both have little variances though.

Adrenalinrush
28th June 2011, 12:16 PM
I'm sorry wasn't very clear. I just meant that the ailerons are 1/2" up / down. Which seems like a ton of trim for a wing I spent a bit of time on building it right.

I always trim power off, then deal with the Torque later from the prop spinning. Torque can make you over trim, if you have the motor off then you wont over trim. I trimmed it slow, and it is still way off compared to every other plane I have built. I haven't really pushed the wing yet, I would like to get it true before pushing it like Airbag does lol.

IBCrazy
28th June 2011, 12:25 PM
My comment was based on the high speed issue. Under high speeds the wings deflect different amounts causing a change in AoA (angle of attack). A small deflection in the leading edge will cause a large result in the roll characteristics. You also want to stabilize the air underneath the plane and keep it from rolling to the tips.

Take the Falcon EPO for example. It stalls very easily. This is because there is nothing underneath the plane to counter act the roll tendency in a dive.

-Alex

roberto
28th June 2011, 06:16 PM
I would bet on a loose servo or structural mishap. All aerodynamical differences are mostly balanced thru the speed envelope unless something is moving with speed.

airbagit13
28th June 2011, 11:38 PM
Unfortunately I built her with anhedral where both wings droop down instead of the wing being flat. I think that its not rolling left but it is just pulling down and i just happened to be turning left. This would explain why pulling up while inverted gets me out of it. Any thoughts?

No servos are loose, I took her out again and here is the results. In the video everything is smooth then I dive and it pulls down.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lzh_k8I04fg

roberto
29th June 2011, 12:05 AM
something loose over there ??

airbagit13
29th June 2011, 12:21 AM
Thats the balance plug cables on my lipo

Greg
29th June 2011, 12:08 PM
lol..where did the rest of the lipo go? hmmmm... i wonder.


....tower, this is flight abi13 requesting an emergency approach to runway 305.

volto
29th June 2011, 04:47 PM
Just a guess but it looks almost like it's going into compression when you dive. You should face that camera backwards and see what the elevons are doing when that happens. Aren't the stock swift elevons pretty flexible? Did you reinforce them to make them stiffer at all?

roberto
29th June 2011, 05:20 PM
How about the elevon mixing, is it even?

airbagit13
29th June 2011, 05:27 PM
Thats a good idea to face a camera backwards, the elevons are kind of flimsy, I dont know why I didnt reinforce them with fiber tape. I will do that tonight. A layer on top and bottom should make them pretty solid.

The elevon mixing is even. I was forced to make a low powered dive, maybe even no power just the prop spinning with the wind and she didnt flip, thank god. So I dont know what that means.

airbagit13
29th June 2011, 09:58 PM
Ok so here is a clip from my DL entree for next monday. Lets just say the full version is one wild ride.

So here I am diving pretty steep, just as steep as other circumstances where I flipped, only this time it didnt flip.

Honestly I dont know what the hell is going on now.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ktUEqen739c

volto
29th June 2011, 10:26 PM
If my suspicion is true, dive angle isn't the issue, it's the air speed. In this clip are you going down wind? Also it is unpowered right? Whereas the other clips had throttle when it flipped?

Edit: nevermind I watched it with sound and it sounds powered, so maybe it was down wind?

airbagit13
29th June 2011, 10:32 PM
I dont think there really was any wind that day. Normally I plan my flights to all be into the wind and i remember that day I could just toss it wherever.

Greg
29th June 2011, 11:09 PM
Make yourself a checklist of things to test, before you go for personal distance records. If you can check off one or two each attempt, you eventually get it.

airbagit13
29th June 2011, 11:15 PM
Lol, i dont do checklists. Balls to the walls!

Greg
29th June 2011, 11:32 PM
Yo dawg, check this plane out. Let's hide this shit and come back for it later. Aight.

volto
30th June 2011, 01:24 AM
Well, turn that cam around and try to repeat the first circumstances when it flipped, I think you will find your answer.

Greg
30th June 2011, 09:39 PM
control surface flutter?

Chad, fly with the camera turned around. +1

Adrenalinrush
30th June 2011, 09:50 PM
I have my maxi pretty extreme taped up. Never had a problem with flutter, even on my blizzard (well a couple of times over 100mph). I was just out tonight and got into a dive I couldn't pull out of. Had to flip it upside down and come around that way to get out of it.

Greg
30th June 2011, 10:04 PM
Anhedral.
Maybe you two got a batch that just has too much built into the wing.

With flying wings, its my understanding that anhedral is needed. but from the sounds of it, it may be too much. Possible?

Blackrat
1st July 2011, 12:13 PM
thats not torque roll, no ways not at that speed firstly and because its random it rules it out

thats 'cause the flaperons are HUGE on the swift , all its needs is the slightest play and the flap slaps the plane into a wobble like that imo ofcourse

airbagit13
1st July 2011, 02:52 PM
So should I cut them smaller?

Adrenalinrush
1st July 2011, 02:54 PM
NO!

you still havent sent me a pic of your wing. Ill send it tonight of mine to show you what I did to strengthen it.

airbagit13
1st July 2011, 03:02 PM
Lol, k.

roberto
1st July 2011, 03:22 PM
my guesses right now are either flutter or a loose hinge close to the horn. backfacing cam?? of course we would like to see you fly from it to!!!!

airbagit13
1st July 2011, 03:32 PM
Yeah I am going to take her up again on Sunday. Will be facing my cam backwards for sure.

Adrenalinrush
1st July 2011, 06:14 PM
Just remeber the controls are backwards when you are looking over the tail

:)

marcin.gala
1st July 2011, 08:27 PM
Guys i try that trick today and dive almost vertically with my Maxi doing 150kph...everything under control.
airbagit13 ---upload some pictures of your maxi ,please from behind with elevons left/rigth up/down.
Where is your CG ?

Adrenalinrush
1st July 2011, 08:52 PM
Here are 2 pics of my maxi.

This one shows the right aileron sticking up because thats the only damn way I can get it trimmed out since my wing was warped from the manufacture. (In their defense they are trying to help me. Even though the first thing out of their mouth was "No returns")
Sorry I am a little hot under the collar about it.

1742

This Picture is looking down on it. I love extreme tape :)

1743

airbagit13
1st July 2011, 09:14 PM
Heres the pics of the plane and I made a video to show the movements. My endpoints are set right where everything is even on the elevons when I give up and down elevator. My only concern now is how I can wiggle the control surfaces substantially when giving a control surface movement like up elevator. Also the servos sound like they are working hard.

I keep saying Carbon tape in the video but I mean Fiber Tape.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bBBzN5pI7eM

Adrenalinrush
1st July 2011, 10:43 PM
Ok too easy to fix.

1. I think you have way too much of a throw. Mine are half that and it flies just fine?!? Someone else might have what they are supposed to be at, I don't think I read the directions or they weren't in there.

2. Taping the ailerons are going to make a WORLD of difference.

3. When you put down the tape. Spray 77 or whatever you have and let it tack up. Then when you put it down, use an old credit card to "push" the tape down into the foam to make an awesome seal. I dont have any wrinkles or tear ups from the wind. It will also make it a little stronger. Tape up your hinges too, those things scare me, I can almost see through mine when I hold it up to the light.

Once you do the taping and fly on Sunday, your going to come back here and post how awesome it flies. I do think your throws are a little too much though.

I don't have any beer in the house, was just looking at the heinekin the hole time.

Clay

airbagit13
1st July 2011, 11:07 PM
im going to tape it up tonight. it seems like those little &%(# stole my 5v UBEC that powers my cam thinking it was valuable. Im just going to power my cam through my RX.

airbagit13
2nd July 2011, 12:59 AM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vfhv1Va-G6E

marcin.gala
2nd July 2011, 06:10 AM
airbagit13 - that just lack ...wouldn't worry about that.
Way too much throws ,reduce that.
You could check is your engine inline with MAXI.Be precise measuring this.
Can't see that on video.
Where is your CG exactly..?
Paint glide test--no engine ,no windy weather..just glide and put elevons 30% down then release stick ,see what plane do...
http://img51.imageshack.us/img51/9965/unleduym.jpg (http://img51.imageshack.us/i/unleduym.jpg/)

Adrenalinrush
2nd July 2011, 08:37 AM
Instead of using the rx for the 5v (which will probably be way to noisy) you can make an LC filter for 5 bucks that gets its power straight off the lipos. And has 5v out.

I am too lazy to make a picture version, but if you need it just ask.

It goes pretty much like this:

Big Cap > Little Cap > 5v Regulator

you can get all of the stuff at radio shack, here is the link to the regulator
http://www.radioshack.com/product/index.jsp?productId=2062599

Adrenalinrush
2nd July 2011, 07:06 PM
Here are the conditions at the airport closest to me


Conditions at

2011.07.02 2153 UTC
Wind from the WSW (250 degrees) at 14 MPH (12 KT)
Visibility 10 mile(s)
Sky conditions mostly clear
Weather Lightning observed (Theres no damn lightning)
Temperature 95.0 F (35.0 C)
Heat index 102.6 F (39.2 C) ITS FLIPPING MICHIGAN WTF!
Dew Point 71.1 F (21.7 C)
Relative Humidity 46%
Pressure (altimeter) 29.87 in. Hg (1011 hPa)
ob KARB 022153Z AUTO 25012KT 10SM FEW060 35/22 A2987 RMK AO2 LTG DSNT W AND NW SLP106 T03500217


I bought the Maxi swift thinking wings are good at cutting the wind. Not so much. Watch the video, 60-70 MPH with the wind. 1-20 mph into the wind.

I kept rolling (Full aileron one way just to keep level flight.) My bird just wanted to flip over constantly, not in a dive but in level flight. It is trimmed because it flies well under the tree line. 14mph winds should not throw me around to where I am upsidedown.

I do have a question. It was easier to fly upside down, should I just mount everything on the bottom then and fly it that way?

Anyways, heres the video.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UEc-k_Ijcsk

roberto
2nd July 2011, 09:15 PM
looks interesting, but I didnīt uderstand the drawings.. :confused:


airbagit13 - that just lack ...wouldn't worry about that.
Way too much throws ,reduce that.
You could check is your engine inline with MAXI.Be precise measuring this.
Can't see that on video.
Where is your CG exactly..?
Paint glide test--no engine ,no windy weather..just glide and put elevons 30% down then release stick ,see what plane do...
http://img51.imageshack.us/img51/9965/unleduym.jpg (http://img51.imageshack.us/i/unleduym.jpg/)

volto
2nd July 2011, 09:57 PM
Yeah I don't understand your glide test procedure there, marcin.gala. If it's nose heavy won't it nose down in a glide? Tail heavy should flutter and stall out I would think.

Blackrat
3rd July 2011, 02:59 AM
you have got too little servo travel for the amount of flap deflection , its all about leverage

how much expo do you fly with ?

what i would do, move the connection on the servo horn closer to the servo, so that the servo can move more and the flap moves less , i cant see that you use half of the deflection on the flaps that you have , or that you have 60% plus in expo, it must be super sensitive to fly ?

glide test for CG ... get the plane flying level using trims
put the plane into a 45 degree dive
if the plane pulls UP its nose HEAVY
if the plane dives more its tail heavy

why ? cause if the nose is heavy on the plane in straight level flight , then you need to put in up trim to get it to fly level. this uptrim causes the plane to lift its nose in a dive ;-)

Blackrat
3rd July 2011, 03:08 AM
or better , put new horns on the flaps that are larger , that allow the wire to be positioned further away from the flap hinge

volto
3rd July 2011, 03:25 PM
...stuff Blackrat said...

Now that's an explanation I can understand. Thanks Blackrat! This will hep me balance my scratch built wing.

airbagit13
3rd July 2011, 09:38 PM
Sorry guys I had no idea that the dicussion here had progressed since I didnt get an email update.

I took her out today after doing all the taping and it seemed to have solved the problem. I put way less throw on my elevons and had to make my Expo a little bit more sensitive. It was turning way to slow. I kept the expo on my elevator -30 on futaba but the expo on my ailerons is -10.

I thought the camera has a wider FOV but this is what I got.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9hRKeYLZBdg

Adrenalinrush
3rd July 2011, 10:07 PM
Ailerons don't look too bad. I would engage the brake on your esc, might help with drag on gliding.

Just want to extend a thank you for someone (anyone) replying to me help me post from above. My Swift is now a crumpled up POS atm in the basement. She turned over just like she always has and decided she didn't want to be a bird, but a mole. Couldn't pull out of the roll this time and BAMMMM my first FPV Crash in 50+ flights.

airbagit13
3rd July 2011, 10:11 PM
Daaaamn dude what a bad one. Sorry to hear about it. How is your gear?

airbagit13
3rd July 2011, 10:25 PM
Here is a different video where you can see the servo and control horns moving. I still dont really trust her at all. Since I was on an island surrounded by water I didnt want to do anything crazy but I am going to take her to my normal field tomorrow and do a full speed dive from 1500 (I mean 400) feet and see what the hell happens.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7sy2Xgg06zg

roberto
3rd July 2011, 10:28 PM
Oh crap Adrenalin. Crashing in FPV is not a good feeling... makes you feel like you got smashed together with the plane.
Looks like you guys got bad batches of swifts, maybe badly cut... i really donīt know but Iīm staying away from them, thats for sure.

damn you guys are lucky to have a holiday tomorrow...

Adrenalinrush
3rd July 2011, 10:47 PM
Roberto,

I have been in contact with Commonsense RC and they have been "helpful".

I told them the cuts between the 2 wing halves were bad and there was a buldge. They told me to sand it down. I ran it through my table saw making a perfect fit. Then when I glued the wings together I noticed on one wing the Spar (along the span) was warped. They told me that I cannot return it because I altered it. I said "I didn't say anything about returning it?!?" (Don't be fooled by stupid crap that dealers tell you. If there is a defect, and you paid with a CC or PayPal, dispute the purchase and you WILL get your money back). Shipping is obnoxious with these big wings so I went about my merry way and put it together anyways. If you look at my post with the video on page 5 or 6 and go about 1/2 way you can see it just roll on its own. I was using full aileron and it still just wanted to roll.

AirBag,

I hope my gear is ok. Haven't checked it just a little pissed off @ CommonsenseRC (whom I would never recommend. Even though they do act quite helpful, you cannot return it (when its not requested) is horrible customer service. Tells me that they are thinking "Gotcha!". Just give me a solution to the problem, make me a happy customer and I will go on my merry way. I will check it all tomorrow. If my brand new securitycamera2000 cam is busted, I will make a RCG post with me pouring gasoline on my wing and lighting it on fire as I talk smack about CommonSenseRC.


I do NOT recommend the Maxi Swift as me and AirBag are having the same problems and the company calls it a " rare inaccurate alignment".


I will be more than happy to forward the long email chat I have had with Bruce from Commonsense. I may make a post about them, depending if I calm down (when I sober up) tomorrow. I doubt it though!

airbagit13
3rd July 2011, 11:00 PM
+1 I wouldn't but another one. I looooooove my little MS Swift 2 but this wing has been nothing but trouble so far.

roberto
5th July 2011, 11:45 AM
Man you are a good pilot. I would have given up halfway into that video...
One and one only thing comes into my mind watching both videos: Loose hinge or pushrod. IMO Nothing else can make your wing roll out of nothing at all.


Roberto,

I have been in contact with Commonsense RC and they have been "helpful".

I told them the cuts between the 2 wing halves were bad and there was a buldge. They told me to sand it down. I ran it through my table saw making a perfect fit. Then when I glued the wings together I noticed on one wing the Spar (along the span) was warped. They told me that I cannot return it because I altered it. I said "I didn't say anything about returning it?!?" (Don't be fooled by stupid crap that dealers tell you. If there is a defect, and you paid with a CC or PayPal, dispute the purchase and you WILL get your money back). Shipping is obnoxious with these big wings so I went about my merry way and put it together anyways. If you look at my post with the video on page 5 or 6 and go about 1/2 way you can see it just roll on its own. I was using full aileron and it still just wanted to roll.

AirBag,

I hope my gear is ok. Haven't checked it just a little pissed off @ CommonsenseRC (whom I would never recommend. Even though they do act quite helpful, you cannot return it (when its not requested) is horrible customer service. Tells me that they are thinking "Gotcha!". Just give me a solution to the problem, make me a happy customer and I will go on my merry way. I will check it all tomorrow. If my brand new securitycamera2000 cam is busted, I will make a RCG post with me pouring gasoline on my wing and lighting it on fire as I talk smack about CommonSenseRC.


I do NOT recommend the Maxi Swift as me and AirBag are having the same problems and the company calls it a " rare inaccurate alignment".


I will be more than happy to forward the long email chat I have had with Bruce from Commonsense. I may make a post about them, depending if I calm down (when I sober up) tomorrow. I doubt it though!

Adrenalinrush
5th July 2011, 12:07 PM
Man you are a good pilot. I would have given up halfway into that video...
One and one only thing comes into my mind watching both videos: Loose hinge or pushrod. IMO Nothing else can make your wing roll out of nothing at all.

used scotch extreme tape for hinges. so i doubt they are loose. the supplied pushrods arnt to bad. tiny loose but nothing to get my panties in a bunch.

thank you for the compliment.

jimmaplesong
5th July 2011, 12:34 PM
Yeah man, sorry to hear about the crash... but I would have crashed much much sooner than you. On the bright side... there's nothing like a complete rebuild to solve aerodynamic problems. If you hadn't crashed, you'd be stuck with that squirleyness for who knows how long! You _are_ going to rebuild, yes? Not a Maxi plank, but maybe something even more swift.

Adrenalinrush
5th July 2011, 01:08 PM
If by rebuild you mean, get a stryker or TS2 yes.

If by rebuild you mean take 2 pieces of foam that cost 125$ that were warped in shipping or in the mold and try to salvage them just to crash and loose $500 worth of FPV equipment..... no

Adrenalinrush
5th July 2011, 01:12 PM
It sucks, Trappy and all of them have had a great time with the swift, and me and Airbag buy ours about the same time and have massive issues.

I was actually thinking of putting my maxi up for shipping to give it to someone. But I would feel awful if someone lost their gear on it because of the defect.

cowboyvidz
18th July 2011, 05:10 PM
Hi Adrenalinrush,

Sorry to bump this topic after so long but I have recently maidened my Maxi LOS on Thursday, I am not sure if it's the same problem but after nearly crashing on the first attempt and actually crashing on the third I initially thought I had gone out of range but this was less than a km with my LRS system so I was skeptical. After a little investigating and a lot of range testing and video review. It seemed that actually my elevons were stalling out at higher airspeeds. I have switched out my servos from Turnigy MG90S to HS-82MG's in the hope that this will go some way to solving the problem, I am also going to tape the crap out of my control surfaces.

I just thought I would let you know that I am determined to get to the bottom of this as at a lot of points during these flights I was having massive amounts of fun.

Chin up all you peeps with Maxi woes, we will get there!

Adrenalinrush
18th July 2011, 06:29 PM
I gave up on the Maxi, and Commonsence RC gave up on me. Don't think I will buy anything from them or recommend them to anyone.

I had the 82MG's in mine, and taped the crap outta the elevons. No luck there either, check your wing spar (along the span) to see if it is deformed, thats the issue w/ mine.

volto
18th July 2011, 09:06 PM
It seems to me that EPP warps easily in shipping from heat, it's probably not commensence RC's fault, but I understand if their support sucks. Might try the wet wash rag and iron trick to flatten it back out.

airbagit13
19th July 2011, 12:43 AM
I'm with Adrenaline, very very disappointed in the Swift. Tomorrow I am going to take her out and go to a few thousand feet and do every kind of test I can think of. Full power dives, full power left and right turns, no power dives. If she doesn't perform flawlessly then I am just going to junk the airframe and get something else.

cowboyvidz
19th July 2011, 05:31 AM
I am not giving up on this bird just yet as she is still quite new to me and I haven't had chance to exhaust myself trying to fix it no doubt I will get there. If anybody wants to get rid of their airframe, I am not sure how much shipping to UK would be but if not too much i would happily pay to get a spare airframe for experimental porpoises, thinking about it the shipping will probably be astronomical.

Please let us know how you get on airbagit, I will also post any findings.

Adrenalinrush
19th July 2011, 05:53 AM
I wouldn't mind giving my airframe to someone who could use it. Your right though shipping is ridiculous.

Remember, loosing one piece of video equipment to a bad airframe isn't worth it.

cowboyvidz
20th July 2011, 04:36 PM
Hi Guys,

I might have made a breakthrough on my issue, I have totally replaced the pushrods for carbon ones will a ball link clevis that can be tightened right up. The result is a no-slop linkage, The elevons are now much more sturdy and much more snappy. I won't have chance to test fly this until Friday due to weather and work. Fingers crossed this will sort my issue I will let everyone know my findings.

airbagit13
21st July 2011, 10:21 AM
Hope it works for you, I am still waiting to test mine out. Hopefully I can get out with her this afternoon but it will probably be this weekend.

cowboyvidz
22nd July 2011, 05:47 PM
I have good news from my side of things, I have changed up the linkages as in my previous post and it has made an incredible difference.

http://img232.imageshack.us/img232/7905/dsc0002rv.jpg

The linkage on the elevon end consists of a ball link which can be screwed very tightly to the control horn whilst still allowing the ball to rotate in it's housing which means a zero slop linkage.

After a quick test I was very happy with performance and spent the rest of the afternoon cruising. This plane is now ultra stable and I wish the rest of you the best of luck with getting your sorted.

airbagit13
22nd July 2011, 07:23 PM
its worth a shot, I have some of those linkages left over from my AJ Slick. Will put them on sometime this weekend.

roberto
22nd July 2011, 07:31 PM
I use helicopter linkage on my wing and they are pretty good. Of course those metal links are the super thing.

airbagit13
25th July 2011, 10:19 AM
Alright so I put her through the works yesterday. I put on the new 600watt motor and 60a ESC and tossed her up. I did not change my linkages because the metal Dubro ones that I am using seem to be rock solid. She flew great, I was able to go full throttle without her pulling left or anything. I took her up high and went to do a powered dive and had the same problem, it wanted to pull left and roll, I fought it with full right aileron as long as I could until I gave up in defeat let her roll inverted and then brought her back around.

At least I know what causes it and know that the plane just has some limitations. It is what it is, I am just going to fly her as a cruiser / cloud surfer until I crash her or get bored of her and then grab a faster platform.

Derek_S
28th July 2011, 02:49 PM
I am kinda jumpin in late, but have you considered replacing the elevons or strengthening them? I made some from coroplast on another wing and have been happy with them. Maybe that or carbon rods will help. Also, it the servo horn mounted on foam? If so I would make a pad that spreads that force out over a couple sq inches, maybe out of lite ply.

I think if you can get those elevons stiffer (and maybe the rods and servos too) you can push harder, if it is worth the trouble that is.

Another idea is to move the servos outboard. Obviously placing them here they contact mid-elevon is best to reduce torsional force. Just an idea.

cowboyvidz
28th July 2011, 04:40 PM
Hi Derek,

Thanks for adding in on this, however, I already have carbon rod stewarts throughout my elevons and have also made it so the servo is acting on the surface in the centre, my opinion is that the design of the horns is cack, the design of the linkages is cack, the elevons themselves are cack but the wing is awesome :)

I have now got quite a few FPV flights under my belt with this bird and love it as a long-haul beast but will definitely be purchasing it's little sister as a go-getter.

airbagit13
29th July 2011, 11:26 AM
I have now got quite a few FPV flights under my belt with this bird and love it as a long-haul beast but will definitely be purchasing it's little sister as a go-getter.

Do it, the little sister rocks, I just finished building my second one last night. The first I flew for well over a year.

HydroThief
15th November 2011, 08:45 AM
on my maxi, one wings was actually thicker than the other where they meet in the middle by about 3mm on top and bottom and the two halves bent away from each other with a 3cm gap at the font.I just stretched the front together and sanded the lip off.
Mine barely made it past its maiden before i tried a full throttle 1400w pass.Even with full sized servos and huge throws full right stick just wasnt enough it rolled over left, upside down, hit the ground and exploded with a full set of fpv gear 30 meters from me:eek:.Bent pins on everything.Was not a happy day at all:(

airbagit13
16th November 2011, 09:51 PM
Damn Hydro that sucks very badly. Thats exactly what mine did, no mater how much left stick I gave it it wouldnt turn so I would give it right stick let it roll and then jam left stick once it was over again and it would hold. Was a really big pain in the ass and scared the shit out of me several times. Welcome the the forum by the way. :)