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biggyclops
29th June 2012, 01:05 PM
Hi everyone! Quick question... i ordered the scout bee 60 and was looking what would be a decent setup for mid to long range.. i will be getting fpv later on but not sure what i should do till then.. one of the requirements would be to order everything from one site any ideas? thinking of getting a futaba 6ch for it as well.. any help will be appreciated.

spangers
18th March 2013, 07:05 AM
Hi all,

Sorry if this is the wrong spot for this but I couldn't find a questions forum.

Basically I am interested in getting into FPV and am looking for a complete kit to get started.

I like the look of the TBS Discovery starter kit (I am in the city so rotors for the moment) however I have a couple of questions.

Is the discovery easy to fly for a beginner? I have only flown gyro copters

What is the range of the 5.8 video that comes with the Discovery starter kit

Is the kit easy to upgrade for more range? I am in Australia so 5.8, 2.4 and UHF are available.

Will the GPS RTH on video or control signal loss?

Any recommendations you could give me on starting out? Books, documents etc

Any other kits I should look at?

I have an electronics background so I am not worried about set up the kits.

Thanks for you time guys, it is much appreciated!

spangers
18th March 2013, 07:56 PM
Also I have about $2000 to spend, any help would be appreciated. Thanks

SENTRY
18th March 2013, 08:07 PM
Ok - 1st start will be the PILOT TRAINING thread : http://fpvlab.com/forums/showthread.php?116-FPV-PILOT-TRAINING-CENTER-YOUR-ROAD-TO-FPV-SUCCESS

spangers
18th March 2013, 09:50 PM
Hey mate, I have read most of the written stuff but I have yet to watch the YouTube videos however, I am basically wondering if the TSB Discovery starter kit is a good place to start crawling.

Choppers are best for me where I am at the moment but I couldn't find a kit that I know works for a good price with room to move.

StompAE86
18th March 2013, 10:49 PM
$2000 is not starting crawling...

spangers
18th March 2013, 11:06 PM
I couldn't find any quads with fpv kits for cheaper than that, obviously I would love to send less but I thought that was relatively cheap for a full fpv setup including aircraft, RC etc. I am in Australia aswell so everything has shipping.

Sorry if you guys are sick of these threads, I am sure you get a lot of them.

I find I learn more through hands on than reading so I was interested in buying a kit that i know works, is good quality and there is room to upgrade.

spangers
18th March 2013, 11:11 PM
Not saying that I am not going to read anything, quite the opposite. What I mean is I would learn a lot from constructing the kit and setting up the FPV knowing that the kit works if done properly.

If anyone has an alternative that is cheaper that would be fantastic! I know that I will probably break some stuff while i learn I am sure.

spangers
19th March 2013, 01:42 AM
I found this kit, http://multirotoruk.co.uk/DJI-F450-Flame-Wheel-Naza-GPS-Ready-To-Fly-with-FPV-FatShark-set-00004.htm. Has anyone had any experiences with these guys? Would this be a good starting set?

Also those videos in the Beginner sticky are excellent! I am going to go on YouTube later and like them all.

CrashAffinity
19th March 2013, 01:48 AM
you really gotta read where sentry pointed you, watch as many vids as you can, then you'll be able to start making informed decisions.

Every starter set is going to be good or bad depending on where you live, your local RF area, your flying experience, etc.

read read read, watch watch watch

StompAE86
19th March 2013, 01:54 AM
where abouts in Aus are you?

I started with a goodluckbuy quad for like $100 with motors esc's and a kk board... I would recommend one of those for your first one

spangers
19th March 2013, 01:59 AM
Hey mate,

In Melbourne, North West. Thanks for that, I would also need a controller, what would you recommend that I could use later for longer range?

Also would you recommend the fatshark googles set for a starter?

I was kind of looking for a kit with instructions for my first setup, otherwise I would probably get a bit stuck and be bothering people on here.

StompAE86
19th March 2013, 02:21 AM
the problem is that absolutely no kit comes with any instructions so why everyone is telling you to read... its just the nature of the beast. I know it all seems overwhelming now but receiving a package with a whole bunch of electronic tech that you dont know what its for will be much more daunting.

If you have zero hands on experience start cheap... a set of goggles with built in 5.8 will let you fly around a park and get used to it all without a massive investment. Without trying a set on though its hard to know if you will like the feeling... took some getting used to

For a radio I use a cheap hobbyking 9x with er9x firmware which makes it a super powerful radio which is UHF compatible, and although 2.4 is frowned upon as a radio link frequency its good enough when starting out because you wont go very far to begin with.

This cam is good for all around performance
http://www.securitycamera2000.com/products/600TVL-SONY-SUPER-HAD-CCD-D%252dWDR-Color-Board-Camera-with-OSD-Menu-DNR.html

That should be all you need to get your feet wet all for around $600
its no long range system but its all upgradable at a later date

hope this helps

spangers
19th March 2013, 03:17 AM
Thanks Stomp, you have been super helpful mate!

Any chance you could link me the quad you started on? There are millions on that site.

Cheers

brosius85
19th March 2013, 03:19 AM
you aren't gonna get instructions. it's pretty simple if you start basic though. (if you are already familiar with RC)

if you are not familiar with RC, save FPV for another day. get some solid hours flying LOS and setting up a couple of birds before you go knee deep with a solid FPV setup. its a lot to tackle without prior knowledge

StompAE86
19th March 2013, 03:31 AM
I cant find the exact kit but it was similar to this one
http://www.goodluckbuy.com/x525-v3-quadcopter-friber-glass-folding-arf-set-kk-multicopter.html
but change props to 10x5 2 blade ones and maybe upgrade FC to hobbyking kk2 board but other then that it should be good to go... the company has terrible customer service (read none) so there is some risk but overall its so damn cheap its hard to beat

the frame itself is pretty big so its stable and slow which is what you want when starting out and on a 4000 mah 3 cell I was getting an easy 10 minute flights.

StompAE86
19th March 2013, 03:32 AM
also im sure there is a bunch of guys around melbourne that can show you the ropes... look in mongrels section.

dalejw
19th March 2013, 07:16 AM
Mate, I'd highly recommend a MQX to get things going. The learning curve is very very expensive without something like that.

spangers
19th March 2013, 07:33 AM
Mate, I'd highly recommend a MQX to get things going. The learning curve is very very expensive without something like that.

Hey dale, you mean a BLADE mQX ULTRA MICRO QUAD-COPTER?

I was thinking the same thing before I dive in that I should get a little one to practice on.

Dust
19th March 2013, 03:33 PM
get your crashes out of the way with things that bounce, not crunch. MQX for beginner multi rotor is my vote too.

spangers
19th March 2013, 04:46 PM
Hi all,

I have ordered the book "The beginner's guide to FPV" (from the FAQ section) and a Blade MQX quad.

Thanks for all your help!

c/f
19th March 2013, 10:54 PM
What makes a radio UHF compatable? Is there a sticker on it or is it more reading on the subject?

CrashAffinity
20th March 2013, 12:19 AM
+1 on the MQX (i have one, it's what got me hooked on multi rotors) and +1 on 5.8, it's not spectacular, but it just works with everything

dalejw
20th March 2013, 01:18 AM
Hi all,

I have ordered the book "The beginner's guide to FPV" (from the FAQ section) and a Blade MQX quad.

Thanks for all your help!

Good start I reckon. I'm fairly new to all this as well but what I'm learning is to not rush and enjoy all the steps along the way. There's a lot to be said for getting a kick out of each time you get something else to work rather than having the frustration of everything not working at once and trying to troubleshoot a load of stuff you don't understand.

Rexnoobs247
21st March 2013, 12:23 PM
What makes a radio UHF compatable? Is there a sticker on it or is it more reading on the subject?

No, theres no sticker on them. Basically if they have a trainer port and are more than a super basic radio (like the one that comes with the sky surfer RTF) then you can hook UHF to them.

TZZDC1241
23rd March 2013, 07:51 PM
In my opinion the mQX isn't the way to go to learn on. I've never had one but I hear a LOT of people recommending it to learn on due to it being cheap and easy. Sadly while it'd fly in a gym pretty well, outdoors, especially with wind and its size, I'd loose the damn thing or crash it within two seconds of flying. Bigger is always better in terms of stability and a gust of wind wont easily knock the Disco out of the sky IF YOU DON'T LET IT. DO NOT ATTEMPT TO FLY FPV IF THIS IS YOUR MAIDEN FLIGHT OR YOU HAVE NEVER DONE LINE OF SIGHT FLIGHTS.

I find the Discovery easy to fly in ATTI mode with the NAZA. I almost like to think the NAZA is the 'secret sauce' in making the Disco look ridiculously easy to fly. Would I recommend one for a beginner? Depends.. If you have $2000+ to spend on one and realistically could afford two at the same time or spare parts as you're buying the Disco then I'd say probably. If however you spend $2000 and really cant afford much more beyond that, maybe in a couple of weeks or a month with a next paycheck then I'd recommend another quad to learn on BUT make sure it has a Naza. Assuming you go the Disco route and assuming you're comfortable with soldering then I'd check the TBS ESC bullet connectors prior to flight, enable the TBS CORE OSD and eventually use that. The Disco fully loaded for me starts to hover at about 55-60% throttle, a couple of clicks above the half way mark and try not to get it 'light on the skids' and hover that way due to prop wash.

What I would do is find a nice quiet parking lot or park with as little distractions, people, poles, light posts, etc as possible. Go on a day when there's little wind as possible, heck even walk around for 5 minutes to get a feel for any gusts that might come up in that area. Assuming you've gone through every part of setup on the Disco, you should be ready to fly. I'd probably take the Disco and with props off confirm that left = left, right = right, etc. If it helps and you're SAFE ABOUT IT, I'd hold the Disco tightly and arm the motors but leave the throttle just above the NAZA's disarm speed and move the sticks around to feel which way the Disco wants to tilt, confirm that everything moves as you expect it, unplug the battery. MAKE SURE THE GROUND IS LEVEL PRIOR to setting the Disco down and replugging the battery in, reason for this is you'll have to compensate for what the NAZA thinks is 'level' when the ground you set it on is at a slant and YOU WILL HAVE TO COMPENSATE WITH YOUR STICKS TO KEEP IT LEVEL instead of going backwards, sideways, etc.

From there I'd set it on the ground and push the throttle up to ~60-65%, a couple of ticks past half way and watch it go up to waist level. KEEP YOUR THUMB ON THE RIGHT STICK (assuming MODE 2 for radio) to move the Disco around since it wont launch perfectly straight up. Once you're up the air then do light movements to get a feel for the movements. OK NOW gentle set the Disco back on the ground!! YAY!! You've done your first flight!! Now repeat the same arming motors, throttling up, wiggle around, setting down. Do this for maybe 5-10 battery packs before you move onto forward flight.

Forward flight: Throttle up and play walk the dog with your Disco, small movements forward. NEVER EVER LET THE ASS END WHERE THE BATTERY PACK IS FACE AWAY FROM YOU, the controls are REVERSED if the Front of it is facing you and that's bad. Do the walking the dog practice for how ever long it takes you to get use to it, small movements, time yourself (timer on the radio) on how long you can fly around on a battery.

You'll spend the next few months getting use to flying line of sight, moving around, etc. Once you get into FPV flying, you'll relearn the first hover, walking the dog, flight exercises that you've done, yes its THAT different. The only advantage to FPV is that the controls are no longer reversed while flying towards you while viewing the video feed.

TZZDC1241
23rd March 2013, 08:05 PM
Hi all,

Sorry if this is the wrong spot for this but I couldn't find a questions forum.

Basically I am interested in getting into FPV and am looking for a complete kit to get started.

I like the look of the TBS Discovery starter kit (I am in the city so rotors for the moment) however I have a couple of questions.

Is the discovery easy to fly for a beginner? I have only flown gyro copters

What is the range of the 5.8 video that comes with the Discovery starter kit

Is the kit easy to upgrade for more range? I am in Australia so 5.8, 2.4 and UHF are available.

Will the GPS RTH on video or control signal loss?

Any recommendations you could give me on starting out? Books, documents etc

Any other kits I should look at?

I have an electronics background so I am not worried about set up the kits.

Thanks for you time guys, it is much appreciated!

Read my other post on your first flight and what to expect. The Disco with the NAZA in ATTI mode is ridiculously easy to fly, you can almost throttle up alone and be in your first hover before you know it.

5.8Ghz might be an OK choice. You obviously avoid issues with WiFi interference if you live in an urban environment but anything can block the signal easily, tree's, ground, houses, you, etc. I went with the tuned 2G4 and couldn't be happier though if TBS offered a 1.2/1.3Ghz video link then I would of taken that. Don't expect the range of 5.8Ghz to be great, I'd say on a good day without much around you, maybe a park length with stock antenna's, etc.

The GPS RTH is a neat idea but I prefer to have it hover or even land if possible but it depends on the environment. If you have a lot of obstacles where you're going to be flying, lots of tall tree's or buildings then RTH might crash into them on the way back. The NAZA can be configured to land in case of radio loss.

Reading wise you should read the NAZA manual, OSD manual, everything you can get your hands on back to front and front to back. Most of your knowledge will come from forums and experience.

Kit wise I'd probably look at a DJI flamewheel or http://ma-ke.ch/zeropulse.html or even the DJI Phantom.

punchy
5th April 2013, 12:33 AM
Nice intro thread... why DJI Flamewheel or Phantom instead of a TBS Discovery?

Also read somewhere about needing to LEARN to solder in FPV... noticed that on a lot of videos, lots' of soldering like you need an Electrical Engineering degree... a little intimidating.

TZZDC1241
5th April 2013, 01:27 AM
Soldering is easy as shit. I can't imagine not being able to solder. Practice, practice, practice.

Rexnoobs247
5th April 2013, 10:17 AM
Yea soldering is really no big deal. Take a couple wires and practice tinning and soldering until you get the hang of it. Watch a few youtube videos too, you'll be a pro in no time.

JozMk.II
30th April 2013, 10:44 AM
Hey everyone,

I'm interested in getting into FPV. I live in a suburban environment, about
5 miles from a major city, with some good-sized open areas(albeit with some
hills in the background) a few blocks from my house. I would like a range of
2 miles, if possible.

I'm currently looking at this package available on readymaderc:
http://www.readymaderc.com/store/index.php?
main_page=product_info&cPath=4&products_id=1012

1. Which antennas should I go with? I'm thinking that going with circular
polarized antennas might be a good idea to eliminate reflection
interference. However, the "standard" antennas listed in the drop-down
menus for the included video RX and video TX are rather tempting due to their noticeably lower cost. Or, should I consider this default patch antenna? What kind of range and reception might I get with each combination? Again, I'd like a range of 2 miles, if possible.

2. I have a Spektrum Dx6i 2.4 GhZ radio and a JR XF421EX 72Mhz radio. Which of these
would be best for FPV? I've heard that 72MHz gets better range with less
interference. What kind of range would I get? What kind of receiver(as in,
the RX for the servos, ESC, etc) should I go with? Once again, I'd like a range of 2 miles, if possible.

3. I'd like to use an LCD screen for display. I'd like something
inexpensive that has speakers and/or that I could plug speakers/headphones
into. Any good recommendations?

4. Is there any way to record video footage from the FPV camera as I fly?

IBCrazy
30th April 2013, 02:22 PM
The best advice I can give you is to set aside 2 hours and watch videos 1-7 on my website. It will explain everything to you. Your questions will be answered.

http://videoaerialsystems.com/education/how-to-videos/

The reason for watching the videos is that only you can truly be the judge of what to get.

-Alex

smoothvirus
30th April 2013, 02:41 PM
MOST IMPORTANT - Listen to everything IBCrazy tells you. :)
I would work my way up to a 2 mile range slowly, testing everything as you go along. For you I think a robust RTH system is going to be a "must have".

1) Antenna choice is going to depend on what frequency band your vtx/vrx is on. 5.8ghz band seems to be the recommendation for newbies as it is the least likely to interfere with your other components. 2 miles is do-able on 5.8.

2)Universal answer for radio range: "it depends"

Your DX6i will not reach 2 miles of range. You might be able to get out to about 3/4 of a mile if your DX6i is on the DSMX standard. If it's DSM2 I wouldn't even fly beyond the boundaries of your launch site with it. Some pilots will tell you that Spektrum is useless for any FPV application at any range, I personally disagree with this because I am using Spektrum myself, sucessfully. However I am only flying at close range for the time being. If you fly Spektrum it is very critical that your failsafe is setup properly and you have already safely tested it.
You might be able to get more range on 72mhz. Having never flown it I don't know much about it. Be aware that it is actually more sensitive to interference than 2.4 is.

For really long range flights you'll need a UHF Long Range System. Might want to start researching those now.

3) display - I use goggles. Others can recommend a display. Don't get one that goes to a blue screen if the signal gets staticy or your aircraft is toast.

4) yes. I use the ReadyMade RC DVR with two RCA couplers attached to my goggles. Works fine.

The experts will tell you as a newcomer to FPV to keep it simple. LISTEN TO THEM. Don't bother with fancy setups to start out with. The forums are full of posts from frustrated newcomers who tried to build really complex setups because they wanted long range. As for me I went with a really simple and robust setup. I thoroughly tested every component before I ever did an FPV flight - and I mean thoroughly, like I was managing a NASA test project at Edwards Air Force Base. Mine worked right out of the box without any problems whatsoever. I fly FPV whenever I get the chance. I'll do long range (like 2 miles out) later.

smoothvirus
30th April 2013, 03:08 PM
One thing that helped me when I first started buying my FPV setup was listening to this podcast episode:

http://www.allthingsthatfly.com/Archive.php?year=2012&month=Mar

Broken
1st May 2013, 01:35 AM
2 miles is do-able on 5.8.

How much power would it take to go 2 miles with a CP antenna on the aircraft and a patch on the ground?
(Assuming a reasonably good installation with attention to self-induced interference, etc...)

Thanks!

smoothvirus
1st May 2013, 07:30 AM
How much power would it take to go 2 miles with a CP antenna on the aircraft and a patch on the ground?
(Assuming a reasonably good installation with attention to self-induced interference, etc...)

Thanks!

Antenna is more important than power, but with the ImmersionRC 600mw vtx and a good pair of CP antennas you can do 2 miles, at least according to the manufacturer. I have been out 3000 feet with my setup and the video signal was rock solid.

dfruehwald
2nd May 2013, 01:40 PM
First off I'm not looking for long range, just some FPV fun.

I have a quad copter (Hoverthings FLIP FPV) frame and a Spektrum DX18 already.

I was thinking of getting
- FatShark AttitudeSD Goggles 5.8Ghz with 250mW TX
- FatShark RCV922 Camera (just to keep it simple)

Would that be a good (short range/simple) starter setup that could grow?

Ernie34
2nd May 2013, 04:28 PM
http://www.readymaderc.com/store/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=4&products_id=781

This is a great setup. I personally love the dominators!

Ernie

dfruehwald
2nd May 2013, 08:32 PM
Now the problem is finding some in stock. RMRC is out and HobbyKing has them but probably by the time HK shipped them here RMRC will have them again. Nobody seems to have the Camera from what I can tell. I just picked that one because its PNP (easy).

dfruehwald
3rd May 2013, 09:21 AM
Found it in stock at Hobby Wireless with the CMOS (CCD Killer) camera instead of the RCV922.

Now I just have to wait for the delivery van ;-)

Ernie34
3rd May 2013, 09:33 AM
Whoo Hooo!!!!

UFCelt
21st June 2013, 01:11 PM
I did start out with the MQX mini quad, first RC thing I have ever flown since I was 15 (47 years ago) and it was a blast. I had a broken ankle and torn ligaments in my knee and needed something to cure the boredom and save my eyes from all the surfing these RC sites. I thrashed and crashed that thing all over the house, learned to chase the cats around and yes I did break a few knick-knacks too, but it sure was fun. I even took it outside and learned to fight the wind once I was able to get around and the weather was better. Squirrels run like hell when you come near them and can't quite understand how that little buzzing monster can chase them up into the branches.
I also bought a Cub trainer type plane and have learned how to land it on its wheels most of the time. Both are run on my DX8 which also runs my AeroSim simulator. I would also suggest new people try the simulators, they do help.
I now also have a Dji Phantom that is really fun to fly and I think a pretty good way to lear more control over the quads, the Naza controllers are pretty darn good but I do agree with a few others that the RTH feature needs wide open areas to keep it from becoming tree bound. Luckily I have never had to use it but did try it once to see how well it worked, it worked. It is cheaper than a lot of other quads and will fly well right out of the box and even better once you hook up to the Dji web to tune everything in. I am adding a 5.8 FPV system using FatShark Attitudes this week to see how it all works.
Soldering!!!! Yes you should know some basics, I learned a bit on model trains over the years so I knew a bit but learning more every day as I work on building a new tricopter to add to my flying machines.

Gotta love this addiction!!!!

rdbell
10th July 2013, 02:39 PM
First off I'm not looking for long range, just some FPV fun.

I have a quad copter (Hoverthings FLIP FPV) frame and a Spektrum DX18 already.

I was thinking of getting
- FatShark AttitudeSD Goggles 5.8Ghz with 250mW TX
- FatShark RCV922 Camera (just to keep it simple)

Would that be a good (short range/simple) starter setup that could grow?

I've been wondering the same thing. With some upgraded antennas it seems like it'd be a handy little portable system, but I don't know what kind of range you can expect. I've heard bad things about the transmitters burning up as well.

juscuziam
11th July 2013, 04:09 PM
I have a DJI F550 with Naza V2 and GPS V2. This will be used mainly for property surveillance and commercial applications, so instead of me buying several components and later find its not what I need then take a loss and have to sell it all and re purchase it I'm hoping you guys can help me make the right decision before hand. I'm in the process of applying for a commercial flight license to fly but need to list all my components and so on so if any of you have experience in the application process that would also be greatly appreciated. I live In Canada, BC. I am looking for a long range FPV system with a dedicated camera. I was looking at a Fatshark system at ready made rc and wondering if that is the direction I should go or maybe subtract and add parts to get where I need to be. http://www.readymaderc.com/store/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=4&products_id=781


- John

rlage
11th July 2013, 04:41 PM
For long range you have to replace radio link to UHF 433Mhz and better to use video on 1.3Ghz ou 2.4Ghz.

Till 2km you could use video on 5.8Ghz with proper antennas.

juscuziam
11th July 2013, 04:47 PM
I will need something that can through light obstructions, this is what im looking at so far

Antennas - Circular Wireless Skew Planar Wheel Omni Combo
Camera - RMRC-700XV NTSC
Video Transmitter - ImmersionRC 600mW 5.8GHz
Video Goggles or Monitor - FatShark Dominator Goggles
OSD - ImmersionRC EZOSD

smoothvirus
11th July 2013, 04:53 PM
"long range" is kind of subjective when it comes to multirotors. A decent 2.4 radio will get you near 1km or 3/4 of a mile out which for an F550 would be pretty far. If you're looking at long range you're going to need to keep in mind that your flight times will probably top out at about 15 minutes maximum depending on payload and what battery you use.

I'll link the build thread for my FPV Flame Wheel F450 here:
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1857064

clearly your battery requirements will be different but I just put together an F550 for a friend with the identical FPV setup to mine. That setup will get you 1 kilometer of range, no problem.

juscuziam
11th July 2013, 05:20 PM
Im using a DX8 with AR8000 so I should stick with the RMRC-700xv camera as it supports 5v so no need for an adapter im guessing.

juscuziam
11th July 2013, 05:39 PM
I also have a RC Eye 650 would the Blue Beam Whip increase the range on this system ? http://www.rclogger.com/Wireless-Transmission/5-8-GHz-Video-TX-RX-System/5-8-GHz-Video-TX-RX-Module.html

also whats the difference between Circular Wireless Skew Planar Wheel Omni Combo and the Blue Beam Whip Antennas

Also where can I find some literature that explains FPV equipment and technologies vides ect ?

smoothvirus
11th July 2013, 08:19 PM
Im using a DX8 with AR8000 so I should stick with the RMRC-700xv camera as it supports 5v so no need for an adapter im guessing.

DX8 with AR8000 is perfect for your application - provided you're flying within 1km range of course. For flying farther than that you would need a long range system to add on to your DX8.
But like I said multirotors are not well suited for long distance flying.
Yes with a 12v camera you'd require some kind of step-up regulator.

smoothvirus
11th July 2013, 08:22 PM
I also have a RC Eye 650 would the Blue Beam Whip increase the range on this system ? http://www.rclogger.com/Wireless-Transmission/5-8-GHz-Video-TX-RX-System/5-8-GHz-Video-TX-RX-Module.html

If the bluebeams fit on those connectors, yes.

I just looked at the specs though, that's a lot of money for a 25mw transmitter. That's not a lot of power, you won't get the kind of range you would get with the 600mw ImmersionRC unit.


also whats the difference between Circular Wireless Skew Planar Wheel Omni Combo and the Blue Beam Whip Antennas

Basically the same thing just different manufacturers.


Also where can I find some literature that explains FPV equipment and technologies vides ect ?

http://fpvlab.com/forums/showthread.php?116-FPV-PILOT-TRAINING-CENTER-YOUR-ROAD-TO-FPV-SUCCESS

everything you need to know to get started is there. Get a cold beer and some munchies, sit back and watch, and learn. :cool:

sparkyincali
12th July 2013, 01:56 AM
Also 5.8Ghz is not going to work well with obstructions.

juscuziam
12th July 2013, 02:58 AM
So the f550 I ordered came in today and I decided to upgrade the frame to a DJI S800 and kept the naza vs and GPS v2 does this open up my options on what I can use ?

juscuziam
12th July 2013, 07:07 PM
I've attached a couple of pics of areas we will be patrolling and we need to launch the drone from below tree level and up to around no more than a 100 feet but as we proceed we will not be in line of site of the craft and will be in the umbrella of forest. Some sites are dense forest and flying will be direct in not from above. Maybe our needs are beyond what's offered but general this is what we will be contracted to do so with what I have in my basket and what we are using for airframe what should we be looking to add ? I have asked about allowable frequencies but have not heard anything back.

John 2905729058

juscuziam
12th July 2013, 07:11 PM
Looking at some high mah lipos any of you used one of these ?
http://www.uavproducts.com/product.php?id_product=175

BrittMac
12th July 2013, 10:30 PM
If you aren't going over 100ft, you are going to smack a tree. The height is deceiving.
Ability for the video to penetrate that, I wouldn't put too much stock in it. I have had good luck at 500 meters using FrSky and 5.8 w/cloverleaf antennas. I have gone below the treetop level, but I was basically behind the top of the one large tree. I would not be confident flying through that on 5.8. You may have decent luck using something like the Duo Rx with a good helical antenna on it, plus a clover.

All in all, after looking at your pictures that you put up, I would think it wise to test a 5.8 system before relying on it. Not flying low level anyways.

juscuziam
12th July 2013, 11:44 PM
Most of our work will be around 100 feet and the pic is one of our more complicated areas and I don't think the heights and issue because I know I can go higher than 100 feet but my question is more that if we see something that needs a closer look to determine our problem and where we would need to send our guys we would need to drop down and this is where I would need system to punch through to get a clear image and not lose contact with the system. I'm trying to avoid buying a system that later I find won't do the job so I'm hoping someone somewhere has done this lol

Maximus
13th July 2013, 12:10 AM
If you're going to fly low over those trees and not within line of sight, chances are very good that your 2.4 radio and your 5.8 video is going to suffer badly. I would suggest UHF radio and 1.2 video. Even with that, you're not going to get perfect video signal when you're low behind a bunch of trees.

the.ronin
6th November 2013, 01:41 PM
<!--[if gte mso 9]><xml> <o:OfficeDocumentSettings> <o:AllowPNG/> </o:OfficeDocumentSettings> </xml><![endif]--> I'm very new to RC in general but am totally hooked. I'd like to kit my DJI Phantom quadcopter with FPV and was hoping to get some feedback.

The reason for wanting FPV is to both be able to navigate better and also to get better video footage. However, being new, poor, and a non-professional, I am trying to keep to an very entry level budget.

1) Camera

GoPro Hero 2
GoPro Hero 2 cable (http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/__46369__GoPro_and_AEE_Magicam_Live_A_V_Out_FPV_Ca ble_90deg_Version.html)

I plan to use the Hero 2 that I'm also using to record the video. I understand that the wide angle can cause issues; its sensors can be less than ideal in sudden changes of lighting; and its aspect ratio renders a letterbox on the monitor but I'm ok with all of these things for now.

2) Transmitter / Receiver

Boscam 5.8Ghz 200mw FPV Wireless AV Tx & Rx Set (http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/__15295__Boscam_5_8Ghz_200mw_FPV_Wireless_AV_Tx_Rx _Set.html)

I understand 5.8Ghz is ideal so as not to interfere with the 2.4Ghz controlling the quadcopter itself. I like this Bascom set because it has decent reviews, decent range, and decent price. I'm curious though about the ones I see on eBay from China that look identical down to the labels just not marketed as Boscam - although they are only slightly cheaper from the HK one linked to above.

3) Monitor

Some generic 7" LCD monitor (http://www.ebay.com/itm/261162662229?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2649)

I'm aware that most people swear by goggles but I think I'd like to use a monitor for now mostly for price reasons but also just preference.

4) OSD

Haven't picked one out and may hold off on this. I'd really like one with navigation components aside from just voltage. Specifically, alttitude, pitch, roll and home.

5) Power

I'm not sure how to determine the appropriate lipo for this setup. What I've seen suggest a 2S 1000mAh lipo for the receiver and a 3S 2000mAh lipo for the monitor. How would I determine the appropriate lipo?

Also, assuming the lipos use a XT60 connector, can I simply use these XT60 female connectors (http://www.ebay.com/itm/New-Male-XT60-Female-EC3-Connector-Adapter-XT-60-NEW-US-Seller-/141015333383?pt=Radio_Control_Parts_Accessories&hash=item20d52b3a07) to connect to the receiver and monitor? Is there any potential harm in powering both the receiver and monitor from a single 3S 2000mAh lipo aside from shortened operating time? (I just want to minimize the number of lipos lying around.)

6) Other Gear

Monitor mount to transmitter (http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/__40608__Universal_Carbon_FPV_Monitor_To_Transmitt er_Mount_System.html)
Transmitter mount (http://www.ebay.com/itm/FPV-OSD-Aerial-Camera-Video-Transmitter-Mount-Frame-For-DJI-Phantom-Quadcopter-/290996831606?pt=Radio_Control_Parts_Accessories&hash=item43c0c34576)

As always, I really appreciate any feedback from you experienced folks.
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btown2
6th November 2013, 02:24 PM
You say you are new to RC in general. So the first place to start is... Can you fly the quad LOS in ALL orientations? If you can't then you need to learn that first. There probably will be a time when you have to fly it los and you don't want to lose your gear and/or damage somone elses property because you can't fly los.

Next is the camera. There are a LOT of ppl here on fpv lab who say using a go pro as your flight cam is a bad idea. The Go Pro is a software driven cam that can crash and if the software crashes or if the battery dies you lose all video. It is best to have a separate FPV cam that can't shut down on you. But if you are insistent on the go pro, I found version .70 to have the fewest stability issues.

Since you are going to use 5.8 you will want to pick up a set of Circularly Polarized antennas for your video gear.

the.ronin
6th November 2013, 03:15 PM
<!--[if gte mso 9]><xml> <o:OfficeDocumentSettings> <o:AllowPNG/> </o:OfficeDocumentSettings> </xml><![endif]--> Thanks for the response, btown2. I have been practicing quite a bit in LOS in all rotations (in normal mode and course lock and home lock). I'm by no means an expert but getting there slowly.

Yes, I am aware of that drawback with using your recording device as the FPV camera as well. I'd like to try it for now and will ass an independent FPV camera.

Regarding the circularly polarized antenna, what would be the drawback of using the stock antennas that come with the Bascom set?

Again, I really appreciate the feedback.
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btown2
6th November 2013, 03:37 PM
Multipathing is the big issue here. If you fly in places with lots of objects around you the 5.8 ghz signal will reflect off the objects and interfere with itself. When a signal is CP tho it has the added effect of reversing the polarity when it it gets reflected. So a Right Hand Circularly Polarized signal becomes a Left Hand Circularly Polarized signal and the CP antenna will reject a lot of the interference by default since it isnt set up to receive the other polarity. Unlike a whip antenna.

the.ronin
6th November 2013, 04:13 PM
Thank you btown2!! Thats excellent information!

sgtsmall
6th November 2013, 04:22 PM
Regarding the circularly polarized antenna, what would be the drawback of using the stock antennas that come with the Bascom set?


I like your approach to this.
Just go with the standards until they don't work, I started with CP, however I tried the standard ones for a test and found for half of my flying they worked well enough.
And you will appreciate the change more when you need it.
Power, the 2S 1000 will run the receiver for longer than you can carry charged phantom batteries!
The monitor needs some thinking, need to calculate it's draw (12V, 7.5W) it is under 1 amp so again 3S 2Ahour is fine although you need to determine if it has a problem with the voltage dropping below 12.
Start with the separate battery config, (my 2S gets a good workout between flights for servo and receiver testing on the bench) you need to confirm the voltage ranges for the receiver, although likely ok.
If the receiver prefers 5-6V but says it can handle 12+ it must be burning off the difference somewhere which creates heat. So an efficient power supply and regulator setup for your GS may be a better future investment.

I use XT60 for all my kit as a standard. However I use the 2.1mm barrel connector for the 2S so it fits the Fatshark and the connectors are easy to come by for other uses. It also discourages me from plugging a 4S into a 6-7V circuit.

ColoradoFlightMedic
6th November 2013, 05:18 PM
Let me make this really simple. You just walked into to the biggest library on the planet for FPV. There's 10's of thousands of books on the shelf, but instead of reading, you walk up to the librarian and loudly ask her to teach you everything you want to know. Can you imagine the look on that librarian's face? How about the rest of the people in the library who are quietly putting forth initiative and the effort to learn? I'm not even going to begin to pick apart your planned budget setup... But I will ask you politely to quiet down, and start reading :)

the.ronin
6th November 2013, 05:28 PM
Thank you sgtsmall!


Let me make this really simple. You just walked into to the biggest library on the planet for FPV. There's 10's of thousands of books on the shelf, but instead of reading, you walk up to the librarian and loudly ask her to teach you everything you want to know. Can you imagine the look on that librarian's face? How about the rest of the people in the library who are quietly putting forth initiative and the effort to learn? I'm not even going to begin to pick apart your planned budget setup... But I will ask you politely to quiet down, and start reading :)

I guess every forum needs one of these. Mr Librarian, I've read quite a few books in your library. I profusely apologize for not having read enough according to your exacting standards. Allow me to borrow more books. WOW. P.S. 2 weeks ago I'd never even touched anything RC much less knew what those initials meant. :)

creyfish40
11th November 2013, 10:39 PM
I am just starting out in fpv and I am trying to gather info so that I make wise investments with my gear. I want to know if all of the fatshark goggles can be used with an alternative 900mhz receiver by plugging in. I want to go ahead and buy the equipment to be able to fly long range even though that will come later down the road as I cannot invest a ton of money into it at the moment. I have noticed these "complete kits" with the predator goggles and a tx and rx and camera for about the same price as a single set of goggles. I'd like to buy this but only if I know that I can alter later to a 900mhz system.

Reliku
12th November 2013, 11:51 AM
Basically speaking, yes, you can. Another feature, "head tracking", however, is NOT available on the predator.

There are also the teleporter goggles, but these offer 320*240 resolution and are not great for advanced flying.

All components however (cams, vtx's etc) (especially all made by fat shark) can be used interchangeably. But there's one thing to keep in mind:

People who've used predators and switch to dominators or attitudes immediately start blaming the world for not making clear how much better they are.

Some people prefer dominators because of the clearer picture
Others (like me) prefer attitudes because of the bigger FoV.

To answer your question: yes, you CAN use 900mhz receivers with ALL fat shark goggles. But there are differences in the goggles themselves as well. I'd REALLY suggest buying either dominators or attitudes since they're a huge step up from the predators or even the teleporters, both of which are "entry-level" goggles.

Dominators are more versatile in terms of components, while attitudes are more "RTF"-like (everything is already installed).

Goggles are equipment that will last for years and years, I'd suggest not going cheap on them. For the extra $100, you can buy goggles you will have much more fun with ;)

OhmEye
12th November 2013, 01:39 PM
Yes, plugging in video from an external vRX is an option. You can also go unplugged by using a repeater. I have the Attitudes which come with a built-in 5G8 RX. If I'm flying an aircraft with a 5G8 vTX I can use just the goggles as a self-contained ground station. If I'm flying something using another vTX band (not 5G8) then I can plug my ground station vRX into a low power 25mw 5G8 vTX and remain wireless. I can also easily capture video with a ground station DVR at the same time this way without having the goggles tethered to anything. There's a lot of ways to configure things, with various tradeoffs in flexibility and results, you just need to decide what suits your style best. In my opinion, there is a lot of benefit to keeping things simple, especially when first starting out as I am, but I think it's good to develop awareness of the options to get an idea of what methods you plan to work toward.

MatZeRO
12th November 2013, 03:08 PM
My first goggles were the Predator V2. I have now purchased some Attitudes. If you can afford it, skip over the preds and get either dominators or attitudes.

Everything they said above is exactly right.

OhmEye
12th November 2013, 03:29 PM
I agree, I chose to skip over the lower end goggles. Your video display is your primary interface for FPV and I know I'm more likely to enjoy it and be successful if I use good gear.

That said, I personally chose the Attitudes after a couple months of consideration for my own preferences. The Dominators have glass optics and modular bays, vs. the plastic optics and non-modular hardware on the Attitudes. However, the Attitudes have adjustable IPD which is VERY important to me for getting a comforable and sharp view, much more important to me than glass optics. Also, the Attitudes include a headtraker and 5G8 vRX for lower cost and have a wider FoV as well, so unless swapping the vRX is vital to you the modularity of the Dominators is no big deal and actually costs more.

Plus, it's worth mentioning that it _is_ possible to swap the 5G8 vRX in the Attitudes with a 2G4 from TBS, the process just involves some disassembly and soldering since the RX module does not use a connector and is soldered, but I decided that 5G8 is an ideal short range link from my GS for when I want to use other bands. I really only care about being untethered when flying short range for quick and mobile setup, and can use a tether or repeat my 1G3 or 2G4 video to the goggles via a low power 5G8 on my GS when I fly long range.

I also am nearsighted and the goggles are effectively useless to me without diopters of the correct prescription. The Fatshark diopter kit only has -2/-4/-6 correction and I need -3, plus I have astigmatism that gives me a headache if not corrected, so I made my own diopters for about $10. My pics of that are here (http://smu.gs/1gA3ggf).

I recommend not skimping on your choice of goggles. Without a good display, the overall experience will suffer, and when you get right down to it, absolutely everything you do in FPV boils down to what you see in your display while you are flying.

steveno
12th November 2013, 03:37 PM
Choices:
Dominator SD - can have mixed results I have about a 67-70 IPD, Doms have no adjustment and I found I could not get them to look even although I tried all suggestions, the picture quality is superb if you could adjust them, the supplier has commented many times that no adjustment does not suit all users, if you can try before you buy.

Attitude SD - image quality is lower, better FOV, but the OSD edges, even though they have IPD adjustment I think the problem is they move the lens and not the LCD so your FOV is like a cone and the edges suffer.

Dominator HD - these sound like they will be the game changer, due for general release first half of 2014 (everyone is waiting with wallets ready) these will be the best FOV, best quality and best IPD range that Fatshark produce.

I just bought the Attitudes after trying the DomSD, I plan to switch to DomHD as soon as I can.

All Fatshark goggles have an AV - out/in cable so base station use is not an issue.

Another choice could be the secondhand cinemizer plus that http://fpvlab.com/forums/member.php?1232-FPV-PLASTICS is selling as I believe they are pretty good as well, the only drawback I think with those is they are base station models, no modules so they have to be tethered to an AV receiver.

Steve.

creyfish40
12th November 2013, 07:04 PM
Thanks guys for the time to respond to my questions! Your advice is very helpful. Right after I posted this question I studied the Fatshark Base goggles and for the price they seemed to be a great value with some advantages over the pred and alt. I also found what seemed to be the best deal on a 900mhz tx and rx with 800mw power from Hobbyking. It comes with a little cheap sony camera and I can replace it with my gopro. Does this setup sound like a good start? Also, my aircraft is a hobbyzone super cub! Don't judge me :) It's kinda fun manipulating it to carry heavy loads and such. I do plan on upgrading but hey, these days you gotta do what you gotta do! One more thing, do you guys think the 800mw av transmitter will be comparable to the out of the box range of the Super Cub? I would assume it would reach out farther but I am not sure.

Reliku
13th November 2013, 06:26 PM
800mw is overpowered and will do more harm than good. Get something lower power. 800mw is only useful if you're going out 20km.
As for a gopro as flight cam, I'd advise against it since they can do funny stuff that make your video go out. It's better to have a separate flight cam.

Keep in mind the basesd is the most basic solution available. It has no headtracking or built-in rx, you're bound to be on a leash, which can get annoying if you're using advanced ground stations. Think this through properly.

Also, I don't know your control frequency, but you might want to look in other video frequencies as well. Depending on where you live 900mhz may or may not be legal.

creyfish40
13th November 2013, 11:39 PM
So, I should stick with a 100-200 mw tx. My rc freq is 2.4 and 900mhz is legal here in US. I've heard alot of bad about 5.8 except that it has great video clarity. I live in the mountains and am worried that 5.8 would be tough to use. Of course, I am not going to fly behind mountains but,! I do have an idea of using a relay tx and rx on a weather balloon about 1000' high which could possibly give me the ability to cross over ranges and such. Has that ever been done before????

Twawsi
14th November 2013, 01:47 AM
I'd suggest some more reading. You seem to be conducting some good research. 5.8 is not a bad freq, if used properly and with proper antennas. Different strokes for different folks. I fly 1.2/1.3, 2.3/2.4, and 5.8, each has there own merit.

akfreak
14th November 2013, 04:13 AM
I am flying Multi rotors, I have the machine, I want to start to put a modest FPV kit together. Where do I start? I have a Go Pro, I have a LCD 7" monitor, My radio is 2.4 but I am willing to change to what ever I need for long range flight. I bight a Turningy 9Xr for this project, but have a JR 9303 and a JR 11x

I have been looking at lots of different forums, and there is so much confrontation, it is all a little overwhelming.

I have looked at so much stuff and I want to know what is the first step I need to take to start building a list of gear to buy that all works great together.
Dragon Link, Fat Shark, Open LRS, ect... the stuff is everywhere.

I am considering a TX RX system that is 433 MHZ, it works with my 9XR, it's the Hawkeye OpenLRS system. Should I start with my TX RX first? And if so, is the Hawkeye OpenLRS a good system and the right place to start?

thanks for your time, AKf

Hans
14th November 2013, 04:33 AM
Start with a 5.8Ghz set (Vtx and Vrx) as your radio is 2.4Ghz. That'll give you a long time of trying out & having fun before going long range :) When you master this, you've probably read into the forum quite a bit to understand what LRS you want. You should understand most of the info that comes with UHF before actually buying one.

akfreak
14th November 2013, 05:46 AM
Can the 5.8 ghz be used later down the road when I do go to Long range RX TX. I know that harmonics have a lot to do with what frequencies you can use so that the video TX wont interfere with the flight controls TX RX gear.

Hans
14th November 2013, 06:17 AM
If you have a clear line of sight, 10 miles is doable pretty easy from what i've read. I even think people went way further than that. Lower frequencies penetrate better though.

How far does a multirotor fly anyway without clenching your buttocks for a safe trip back home?

Reliku
14th November 2013, 09:11 AM
I agree with Hans, go with a 5.8 setup. Even if you go with a LRS later, 5.8 will work fine.

5.8ghz is compatible with ALL types of radios. The only ones that are really incompatible are 2.4ghz video with 2.4ghz radio. 1.2 and 2.4 can have harmonics and so can UHF and 1.3 but generally speaking that can be solved and they can work fine together. 5.8ghz however is compatible with everything ;)

Stay with 2.4 for now. UHF is more complicated and more expensive and requires more knowledge and generally also a HAM licence and so on. 2.4 radio and 5.8 video will serve you well, as long as you don't use spektrum :p

Reliku
14th November 2013, 09:17 AM
5.8 works great, as long as you don't fly behind anything (big). 5.8 will cover a tree. It won't cover a row of trees.

2.4 will cover a row of trees, but not a forest.

1.2 can somewhat slightly make it possible to fly behind big structures, parts of mountains etc. But generally, 5.8 is just fine. 900mhz is legal in the US but it's not a very widespread frequency, so it's hard to get hold of good equipment (antenna's etc), while 1.2 and 2.4 and 5.8 have som really well established kinds of equipment. It'll work though!

As for complex systems involving balloons... MAN! Stick to the most basic and most important rule of fpv. ESPECIALLY when you're a beginner: KISS.

Good luck :)

crashy
14th November 2013, 01:39 PM
I'm about 6 months in to my FPV adventure (fixed wing), so I don't have a lot of experience, and I still remember very well the initial sense of bewilderment at what to buy, what to do, how to make it all work, etc. What I settled on, and has made me very happy, is exactly what the others have been recommending.

Control: Stick with 2.4 for now, or even FM if you have it (maybe the 9303 or 11X?). I'm currently using an older Futaba 8U radio (originally FM) with a FrSky D-series module, and I know that this is good for at least 1 km (and probably 2 or more, depending on antenna selection). You'll probably want to go UHF at some point, but I would say avoid it for now... but research the systems that are available. There are lots of conflicting opinions about which systems are worth your time and money, and they usually are more difficult to set up and use. I just bought a HawkEye OpenLRSng system to experiment with, but I haven't even powered it up yet... I actually have to read documentation to figure out how to configure it and use it, which is not the norm for me! With the FrSky 2.4, I just plugged it in and started using it, no problem... but that doesn't seem to be the norm for LRS units.

Video: Go with 5.8 transmission and circularly polarized antennas (such as cloverleaf on VTx, skew planar wheel on VRx) . I've got two different systems now, and I love them both... but the first one is definitely what you should model your first system on.

First is my FatShark Teleporter V2, which includes a pair of QVGA-resolution goggles with integrated 5.8 receiver, and a FatShark 250 mW transmitter. This is the "no hassle pick up and go" system, because it doesn't need a separate ground-station, and there are no extra cables to lug around. The VTx is powered by the plane's main flight battery using the balance port, through a filtered adapter that came with the Teleporter system. The goggles have a battery that is conveniently retained in place by the headband. I sometimes wish the goggles had a bigger field of view and higher resolution, but for ease of use and convenience, this system is hard to beat. I've gone a kilometer with this system.

Second (put together more recently and still actively evolving) is a complicated system using FatShark, BosCam, and EagleTree gear... with a 200 mW transmitter (TS351) with EagleTree OSD Pro (with data logger, GPS, altimeter, stabilizer, and return-to-home) on the plane, and a multi-function ground station. So far, I've only flown short range with this setup. The GS has an EagleEyes unit for diversity, AV distribution, and eventually antenna tracking and possibly live telemetry and GPS track display; it has two AV inputs, four AV outputs, pan and tilt servo outputs, and USB. Video output goes to a pair of FatShark Base goggles (VGA resolution, 46 degree FOV), and/or a 7" LCD; the other two AV outputs are currently unused, but one will eventually be connected to a video recorder and the other may just be left as a spare (perhaps for a spectator to use my Teleporter goggles in AV input mode). Two Boscam RC305 receivers provide video input to the EagleEyes, which automatically selects the better of the two signals (based on image quality). Right now, one receiver has a skew planar wheel and the other has a cloverleaf; as similar as these antennas are, I do still see the EagleEyes switch reliably from one to the other as image quality degrades. I've got a helical antenna ready to be tested, and there's a crosshair antenna that should be arriving any day now. Depending on how those work out, I may or may not add a pan/tilt mechanism to be driven by the EagleEyes. I'm wondering about the feasibility and utility of running a crosshair on one receiver and the helical (with pan/tilt) on the other.

(I really like the second system, but it has a lot of components and is not convenient to use. Of course, it's already a lot more capable than the first system, and has a lot of potential yet to be explored... but it is NOT what I would recommend for a first system.)

Anyway, I've rambled on a bit, but I hope you find this useful.

p.s. EagleTree just announced the Vector FPV system for fixed wing and multirotors, and it looks to be totally awesome and much easier to set up than the OSD Pro. I didn't mention it above, but getting the OSD Pro up and running reliably took a bit of work. It's *very* capable, but I wouldn't call it plug-and-play. On the other hand, Vector looks about as plug-and-play as you can get.

squishy
14th November 2013, 01:51 PM
Don't buy expensive stuff, just keep it super simple cus...

yer gonna crash...

crashy
14th November 2013, 01:58 PM
^^ Nice! :)

I love how squishy boils down so much of what I was trying to convey. If your goal is just to fly FPV, keep it simple. If you also enjoy fiddling with things and constructing overly-complicated systems to accomplish basically the same thing, then start spending more money (oh god, so much money) ... but not for your first system!

crashy
14th November 2013, 03:35 PM
Camera: I haven't flown with a GoPro as my flight camera, so I can't really comment much on that. One thing I don't like about that setup is the GoPro using its own battery. However, I do know that you can get a good Sony 600TVL CCD camera for $30 to $50, depending on the vendor. I bought a couple of these recently at a good price and have been very happy with them.
http://www.surveilzone.com/sony-super-had-ccd-600tvl-board-surveillance-camera-fpv-xat5200

Transmitter/receiver: I'm using the same video hardware in one of my setups (Boscam TS351 and RC305). I like it a lot. I noticed a big difference between the stock antennas and even a cheap circularly polarized set (cloverleaf on transmitter, skew planar on receiver), probably because my usual flying location has lots of multipathing issues (e.g., reflections from chainlink fence).

Monitor: About your monitor... look carefully to find one that will not go blue-screen on weak signal, or will at least decay gracefully (snow/static) before that and then recover quickly.

OSD: I haven't used any of the less expensive OSDs. I jumped immediately into an EagleTree OSD Pro, which is great but a bit pricey and not the easiest to set up. Actually, I'm not done setting it up yet... it is so configurable, and has so many features and options, that you really have to plan what you want and then test each feature. Awesome capability, but not plug-and-play. Their new Vector system may be the solution to that, but it may be more spendy than you desire.

Power: I tried powering my Boscam video receiver with a 3S a couple of times. It worked fine, but it got really hot. Stick with 2S for that. If your monitor will work down to 6V or so, you can even use the same 2S LiPo just fine.

Other: I haven't tried this. I prefer goggles for the more immersive experience, but then again, I don't have to look down at my RC transmitter much because my planes tend to be very simple, control-wise.

Also... if you've only been looking at this stuff for 2 weeks, you're obviously doing well. You've asked many of the right questions.

Good luck!

crashy
14th November 2013, 03:44 PM
I started out with FatShark Teleporter goggles (including integrated 5.8 video receiver). QVGA resolution and pretty small field of view (less than 30 degrees). I still have these as my "pick up and go" kit, but I GREATLY prefer the FatShark Base goggles I purchased recently - VGA resolution and 46 degree FOV. Wow. Just wow. These are so good, I can't even imagine what it would look like with higher resolution.

EDIT: Forgot to mention, my Teleporters have a fixed inter-pupillary distance whereas the Base goggles are adjustable. IPD adjustment is a very nice feature to have if you are not "ANSI standard man" conformant.

KellyR
14th November 2013, 05:37 PM
Trying to pick out the right goggles can be tough. Unfortunately, we can't just go down to the LHS & try them all out. Everyone has their own opinion about which kind they like & which suits their needs too. For me, I fly a quad using 2.4Ghz & the video system I just bought is 1.3Ghz 300mW. Now I'm saving for a pair of the new FatShark Base's. I was able to hook up with sailingeric & give his Attitudes a try. I was going to get the Dominators, but I liked the bigger FOV (35 not 30). I've heard a lot of people say they don't notice the difference in the res, but really do in the FOV. The Base & Attitude are the same except without the 5.8Ghz vrx & head tracking. For me, on a quad, I don't see myself using head tracking. I've also chosen to 1.3Ghz for video & don't see myself using the 5.8Ghz - even to go wireless at the base station. I don't really see the point. I'll be sitting in a lawn chair & can't walk around without seeing anyways. It does have the best quality of picture & uses the smaller antennas, but it doesn't have the penetration I was after. I'm not looking for distance, using 2.4Ghz rc limits my range already. I want to fly through the trees at the park or while camping/hunting.

Oh, I agree with the above too. Skip the Teleporters (they're like trying to use an old CRT monitor from across the room) & the Predators (an upgrade from the CRT to an LCD screen, but still across the room). IMO of course. ;)

Reliku
14th November 2013, 06:03 PM
Get some quality goggles first though. The fat shark base's crash is talking about are the OLD ones and also have their fair share of issues. You're better off buying more modernized goggles in my opinion. Go with the dominators, attitudes or basesd if you're like Kelly. Or wait for the dominatorHD, but that's gonna take at LEAST a year I reckon :p

Don't save money on your vision, so to speak :p

KellyR
14th November 2013, 06:03 PM
+1 for using a separate camera. Even $50 is cheaper than replacing your ride! :)

KellyR
14th November 2013, 06:20 PM
^You're right Reliku. The old Base goggles had the same res, but a large 45 FOV (like using the CRT monitor, but sticking your face right up to it). :) You're hard pressed to find those much anymore. I'm not sure why they reused the name. It can confuse people.

Ryan Barnes
15th November 2013, 03:02 PM
Ronin,

ColoradoFlightMedic may have came off a bit harsh, but there is truth in his statement. Let me explain...

New people show up all the time in the RC hobby on forums and ask the question "what's the magic formula? Tell me everything I need to know so I instantly have all the answers." There are a lot of us that have spent the better part of 20-30 years flying RC planes/heli's. In that time we have spent 1000's upon 1,000's of dollars and hours in trial and error to gain the knowledge base that we have today. So there are people that are very protective of that knowledge and feel like the "new guy" has to put in some time searching through the hundreds of threads on these forums before they are worthy to receive that knowledge.

Basically, when you ask a question, don't overload the group asking a bunch of stuff all at once, instead break it down into a specific topic and get an answer then as time goes you'll get more info about other things. "The community" is generally all here to help and is pretty welcoming, and that includes to the newcomers also. They just want to see that you're doing some legwork and not coming across as "give me all the answers so I can go fly."

Welcome, and I hope your venture into FPV is successful.

MustBeMattyXD
15th November 2013, 06:59 PM
to power the moniter and receiver you could always do what i do, have 2 3s 2200mah lipos in parallel, ust give more output current and tends to lower the voltage quicker

lucien
16th November 2013, 09:17 AM
New people show up all the time in the RC hobby on forums and ask the question "what's the magic formula? Tell me everything I need to know so I instantly have all the answers." There are a lot of us that have spent the better part of 20-30 years flying RC planes/heli's. In that time we have spent 1000's upon 1,000's of dollars and hours in trial and error to gain the knowledge base that we have today. So there are people that are very protective of that knowledge and feel like the "new guy" has to put in some time searching through the hundreds of threads on these forums before they are worthy to receive that knowledge.



Then why are you on this forum? Honestly, I'm mystified why you and guys like FlightMedic are even here? If you're so "overloaded", how did you find the time to write this boorish post?

I've also been in RC for decades, spent loads of $ and acquired lots of "intellectual property" over that time, but have never felt like it was "mine" to keep. And only to stingily apportion out to newcomers as if I were giving away the family jewels.

I've run into guys like yourself over and over throughout the years and I don't understand why you're even on these forums. Especially those dedicated to the sharing of information - if it's "your" information that you want to keep to yourself, why are you even here? To talk down to the poor ignorant n00bs? What do you get out of that exactly?

That's a real head-scratcher for me, why someone so opposed to the community notion of sharing information would want to participate in a community devoted to the sharing of info. Speaking for myself, I freely give away (Gasp!) whatever knowledge I've gained if it's helpful for someone else starting out. Sure, there's laziness and then there are true inquiries for information. But I don't feel like what I know is mine and only mine, especially as a tool to congratulate myself on my lofty state of education and to talk down to others.

I would say, if you're really really suffering from the burden of having to share what you know, you guys should go form another forum of your own where there are no n00bs to bother you. There, you can gather and not share what you know all you want. I think you're wasting your time here boasting about how much you know and how undeserving others are of all that knowledge. That's not very impressive and it doesn't appear to be what this forum is about.

So, to use FlightMedic's terms, I would ask _you_ to politely sit down, be quiet, and let those of us who actually _want_ to help, help.

LS

Ryan Barnes
16th November 2013, 10:37 AM
Fine, I'll sit down. I'll leave you to continuously answer the flood of the same questions that pop up week after week that could all be answered with a little time spent on the search bar.

lucien
16th November 2013, 10:55 AM
Fine, I'll sit down. I'll leave you to continuously answer the flood of the same questions that pop up week after week that could all be answered with a little time spent on the search bar.

Works for me (jeez, cry me a river, why don't you...); don't let the door hit your $$$ on the way out.

LS

lucien
16th November 2013, 11:13 AM
I'm very new to RC in general but am totally hooked. I'd like to kit my DJI Phantom quadcopter with FPV and was hoping to get some feedback.

The reason for wanting FPV is to both be able to navigate better and also to get better video footage. However, being new, poor, and a non-professional, I am trying to keep to an very entry level budget.

I also started FPV with the humble Phantom, and it's pretty easy to outfit it for FPV. My gear was:
- Fatshark Attitudes. These may be a little pricier than your budget, but one nice thing about them is they come with a 250mw FS 5.8ghz transmitter, with a power lead that'll work off the balance lead on a 3S batt. The xmitter seperately is another $50 or so, so that was a decent value.
- any of the small surveillance cams from RMRC will work fine. Eg.
http://www.readymaderc.com/store/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=11_62_12&products_id=200
is a good deal for starting out.
- I like the Fatshark/ImmersionRC antennas because they're bendable and easy to orient, eg:
http://www.readymaderc.com/store/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=11_45_49_97&products_id=1058
They're also circularly polarized and so they're relatively immune to mulipath interference.

What I did was just velcro the xmitter to the bottom of the machine. Since I don't have a gopro, I just modified the supplied mount to take a surveillance cam. But even if you do have the gopro, you can velcro the cam to the battery door. _make sure_ tho that you have some means to secure the door so it won't fall open in flight... I just have a velcro strap that attaches to the front of the door and to another piece of velcro on the top of the Phantom.

Then I run the xmitter simply off the balance lead of the flight batt. PResto, instant Phantom FPV.... No pics at the moment, but here's a similar way to do the same thing:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iHqpKrrvH9M

So if you buy these bits used, you can get an FPV setup on a phantom for really super cheap and it'll be a blast...

PS: here he describes using the GoPro vid out for FPV, but you can see how you can velcro a survelliance cam to the front of the door above the GoPro... But the transmitter attach method is what I did also.

LS

JP1
16th November 2013, 11:45 PM
Get some quality goggles first though. The fat shark base's crash is talking about are the OLD ones and also have their fair share of issues. You're better off buying more modernized goggles in my opinion. Go with the dominators, attitudes or basesd if you're like Kelly. Or wait for the dominatorHD, but that's gonna take at LEAST a year I reckon :p

Don't save money on your vision, so to speak :p

Good advice but I don't agree on the goggle recommendation. I just got some new FatShark Attitudes yesterday and tried them out this morning. Disappointing to say the least. I thought these would be an improvement over my Foxtech AIO goggles, They fit nice, seal out the light awesome, are supposed to have an improved RX, they have IPD adjustment, and I expected the image to be at least as good as My Foxtechs. Boy was I let down when I turned them on and tried to fly. The plastic optics are terrible, The chromatic aberration is throughout the entire image and extremely smeared around the edges. Maybe they work for open air flying, but in close proximity of trees and such I flew for just a few minutes, I felt like the camera was out of focus and with all the fringing throughout the image I could not make out any details, felt out of control and had to land. I was very excited to receive these after the long wait from H K Land, but very disappointed now.

I don't love my Foxtech AIO Goggles. The image quality has always been fine, but the fit is not great, they leak light around the sides of my face, and the RX performance is not good at all, so I always use an external RX. But now I know the Fatshark image Q does not even compare. The Attitude may have a good wide 35 degree field of view and IPD adjust, but at best only a small circular spot is clear and even that spot is not great. My Foxtech AIO does not have IPD adjust but it doesn't seem necessary as even if I move the goggles around the whole rectangular image remains sharp and clear. If I move the Fatsharks around the circular spot moves around so I can make a point clear but not the whole image.

This was a waste of money for me, hopefully I can sell them and recoup some of my loss. I hope others consider before buying plastic optic models. I expected it would be a little worse but I think that would be an understatement. Hopefully the Dominator HDs will be much better.

JP1
17th November 2013, 12:08 AM
To illustrate visually, I took pictures of the LCD screens of the brand new Fatshark Attitude, and the Foxtech AIO, both receiving the same video from my quad.

First the FatShark Attitude.

http://www.jpshooter.com/pics/fatshark/Image_Comparison_FatShark_Attitude.jpg

And Foxtech (Boscam) AIO. Note the greenish blob spot on the tree to the right is a sun spot where I accidentally let the sun burn my LCD.

http://www.jpshooter.com/pics/fatshark/Image_Comparison_Foxtech_AIO.jpg

I don't know about you but trying to fly with that image didn't seem good to my eyes at all.

KellyR
17th November 2013, 04:09 AM
JP1,

Dude, that sucks! I don't remember Eric's BaseSD's looking like that. Makes me wonder if they're defective.

Reliku
17th November 2013, 08:32 AM
Mine do have edges washed out a bit, but it's not bad really. In fact I'm very happy with mine! Compared to my old goggles they are amazing!

Keep in mind the increase of FoV might have something to do with this.

I'm not denying it though. Other goggles seemingly have better optics, but I'm happy with the results I got. It's a bit of a trade off after all.

Just wait till we can use the rift for fpv :D

JP1
17th November 2013, 02:04 PM
Mine do have edges washed out a bit, but it's not bad really. In fact I'm very happy with mine! Compared to my old goggles they are amazing!

Keep in mind the increase of FoV might have something to do with this.

I'm not denying it though. Other goggles seemingly have better optics, but I'm happy with the results I got. It's a bit of a trade off after all.

My Foxtechs have a 32ļ FoV, the Attitudes slightly larger 35ļ FoV to me wasn't a noticeable difference. I was fully prepared and expecting some fringing, and when I first put them on thought Oh that's a lot of fringing, but it'll still be OK, Then I went for a flight and immediately realized wow, this is not good.

I fly a quad, and in proximity, so peripheral vision is important. As soon as I was flying My brain tried to focus on the periphery which was all blurry combined with all of the red and blue color fringing the picture was just too confusing. Believe me I wanted them to work, but then I started comparing my two goggles and said this just won't work.

The picture I took, I tried to get it as best I could but the small sweet spot made it difficult as well, but I think it represents pretty well how they look.

I probably shouldn't be putting these goggles down so much if I really want to sell them :D


Just wait till we can use the rift for fpv :D

That probably belongs in the "I want to Puke" thread. ;)

Reliku
17th November 2013, 04:51 PM
I'm fairly happy with mine. It's barely noticable really :/

JP1
17th November 2013, 04:59 PM
That probably belongs in the "I want to Puke" thread. ;)

Nevermind It already is ;)

Reliku
17th November 2013, 06:57 PM
I don't think it'll make you puke if you're used to it though :)

Dust
17th November 2013, 10:01 PM
That is a pretty stretched out FOV. I was kicking around the idea of getting an extra set of goggles for backup/passenger ride-a-longs. I have Doms. looks like ill be getting another set of those, i love mine. Dont look like that (attitude screenshot) at all. Thanks for helping that choice a bit easier for me.

Fidy$Trainer
18th November 2013, 07:01 PM
So I've been dying to get into FPV. I've got three aircraft 1) 600size quad, 2) MQx 3) Bixler 2

I'd like to have two setups one micro and the other for my larger plane. So I'd like to have a simple base station utilizing my laptop already own, USB Video capture device (my DVR and 15" LCD monitor :-) already own. So I'm really shopping around for a simple inexpensive but operable FPV system that I can swap out using ONE reciver for now. I had 5.8 system in mind.

I was thinking of using this system for Tx/Vx and it's multiple channels would allow me to expand on buying different brands of Vx as I expand. Boscam RC832 5.8 (http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/__43724__Boscam_5_8g_600mw_32CH_FPV_Wirless_AV_Tx_ Rx_Set_TS832_and_RC832.html)
This looks very similar to other brands out thier FoxTech, and Elgae they all look identical to me just curious if it made a diffrence where I buy it? Customer service etc... an issue.

Question: Should I stay away from this line of inexpensive equipment? Is it good or crap?
Nobody seems to have details on cameras and how to hook them up if it's 5v or 12v and or selecting a BEC and if you need a voltage regulator then what size etc...

So basically I'm looking for a build log of someone that's used some inexpensive equipment but that's had success with it and list all or most of the components they have used.

crashy
19th November 2013, 02:32 AM
I haven't used that set, but the Boscam gear tends to work pretty well. I have the TS351 and TS353 transmitters and some RC305 receivers, and they work great. Make sure you equip them with circularly polarized antennas. Run the transmitter on 12V (3S) and the receiver on 7.4V (2S).

I like the Sony SuperHAD 600 TV line camera with a 3.6 mm lens. It can be had for about $30 to $50, depending who you buy from. From Security Camera 2000, it's called PZ0420. From SurveilZone, it's called XAT5200. Save yourself a little work and buy the camera to servo connector cable for a couple of bucks. It will plug directly into the Boscam transmitter and use the 12V that it supplies.

You will not be happy trying to use a USB video capture device for your flight screen. Trust me on this. I don't think ANYONE would say that this is a good idea. Instead, buy yourself a cheap 7" or bigger LCD that advertises "no blue screen" or "snow screen". These can be had pretty cheap. This one works pretty well, and can be powered from the same 2S LiPo that's powering the receiver:
http://www.surveilzone.com/7-inch-lcd-fpv-monitor-hd-800X480-snow-screen-display-no-blue-screen-cm1120f

You mentioned a BEC or voltage regulator. You don't really need these if you choose your gear appropriately. The stuff I've described above was chosen to minimize the number of different power supplies needed... one battery on the ground, one on the vehicle (for video transmitter and camera). Plus, if your vehicle is using a 3S LiPo, you can use it to power the video gear... just tap off the feed to your ESC (you probably need to filter this supply though, so a separate 3S may be the way to go at first).

Hope this helps.

Reliku
19th November 2013, 08:58 AM
http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/__11974__2_4GHZ_100mW_Tx_Rx_1_3_inch_CCD_Camera_PA L.html

http://www.ebay.com/itm/141112164569

That's what I started with. Yes it does bluescreen. Upgrade to proper goggles and use these for passengers when you're more experienced. Yes it's 2.4 video, so don't use 2.4 control. 35/72mhz is the way to go if you don't have a LRS yet. This setup will get you 2km+ video wise assuming you fly at decent altitude and don't use 2.4 control, and you're not going to fly that far for the first months anyway, trust me. It won't bluescreen quickly so not to worry there.

Yes the components are cheap. That's what you asked for. It worked great for me until the plane it was mounted on disappeared. I'd recommend it. Just make sure to reverse the camera plug and check for major soldering errors.

Good luck!

PS: stay away from your laptop for this. Trust me.

JP1
6th December 2013, 11:49 PM
Just an update. I got rid of the Fatshark Attitudes and just tonight got the new Skyzone FPV goggles from Foxtech. I got the Skyzones for the same amount as the Fatsharks cost me, about $380 with free shipping and arrived in a week. Too bad I didn’t just get these first, I took a little loss selling the Attitudes. But I’m very excited now. Boy if I thought there was a night and day difference between the Attitudes and the Foxtech AIO, now theres another night and day difference from the AIOs to the Skyzone.

The image is tack sharp edge to edge, bright, contrasty, and great color, 854x480 resolution, Glass optics, IPD adjust, and dual diversity 5.8G 32 ch RX, these are awesome. Just testing indoors I can tell already the RX is a huge improvement, though I’ll know for sure if the rain stops tomorrow and I can do some flights outside. The Eyecups don’t fit and seal out the light quite as good as the Attitudes but it’s a big improvement over the AIOs which don’t fit well at all. The display is 16x9 so the 4x3 camera image is stretched out but the view is good, we’ll see if it’s weird outside. I’m not sure what the FOV Angle is exactly but it seems about the same as the AIO which is 32, it’s a little different being 16x9 the image is wider but maybe not as tall. It seems like a good comfortable view. They also have a little camera built in so you can push a button and see what’s in front of you without taking off the goggles. I’m really happy with these now. My Foxtech AIOs will likely become passenger goggles now.

Carbon
7th December 2013, 12:51 AM
Don't buy the Predators, biggest waste of money on FPV I've ever made. I hate these things, but I can't seem to sell them. I'd prefer a screen except the portable size of goggles. Honestly it turned me off to Fatsharks, I'll probably get SkyZone goggles when I decide to upgrade.

Reliku
7th December 2013, 07:52 PM
Predators seem to be so bad lol..

JP1
8th December 2013, 01:41 AM
Well I put about an hours flight time on my new Skyzone FPV goggles and I have to say I really like them. They work great, the diversity RX works great, I didn't do any distance but flying around obstructions, I'd say they do as good if not better than my ground station receiver and definitely better than the Attitude and AIO internal receivers. The 16x9 view is no bother at all. The only negative is the eye cups while the seal out light better than I first thought, the rubber is a little stiff and sort of cuts into my face, it downright hurts after a few minutes. The Attitudes were much more comfortable. The Syzone body shape and eyecups appear to be a copy of the dominators so maybe if I'm lucky I can fit some Dominator eye cups on these. Or do a ski mask mod.

SurveilZone
8th December 2013, 11:06 PM
The camera I recommend the 600tvl sony super had II CCD classic FPV board camera($29) (manufacturer of this 600tvl board camera)
http://www.surveilzone.com/sony-super-had-ccd-600tvl-board-camera-2.8mm-lens-fpv-cc1333
The 5.8G wireless TX, I recommend the boscam wireless tx:
http://www.surveilzone.com/5.8g-8ch-200mw-fpv-wireless-av-tx-transmitter-ws1141
and the 1.258G 1.280G 2ch 800mw wireless TX($40) is a good choice too
http://www.surveilzone.com/1.3ghz-av-800mw-wireless-transmitter-ws1142

JP1
12th December 2013, 10:26 AM
Update: I bought some dominator replacement eye cups from RMRC and they fit OK on the Skyzones. The Fatshark cups are made of a softer rubber so they don't seem to cut on the edges. They feel a bit more comfortable. Now I'm happy. :)

marcus
15th December 2013, 04:49 PM
Hello,

First off, full disclosure: Iím new to FPV, but wish to Ďbegin with the end in mindí so that I can plan accordingly and not waste unnecessary money (you guys really sold me on this point in the Ďif you could start overí thread).

Anyway, Iím purchasing a DJI Phantom II. With this setup, Iíll be running a GoPro Hero 3 Black and really want to eventually run a FPV setup after Iíve gotten more comfortable with the quadcopter. I donít care much about the quality of the FPV video (as Iíll use the GoPro for actual recording), but what I care most about is the overall video transmission range. The Phantom has a range of about 975m, so if I could get close to that, this would be ideal. Also, speaking to another thread I read here, I'd prefer to go for the simpler and more clean options.

From what Iíve read here, I know there are tradeoffs for different options (e.g., Goggles vs Monitor, 2.4 vs 5.8, etc.). Considering my goals, what specific products would you recommend to me?

Thanks for taking the time to help a newbie. Happy holidays!

Hans
16th December 2013, 01:05 AM
Videotransmitter frequency depends on the radio you use. If you use a 2.4Ghz radio, the only option for video is 5.8Ghz. RMRC has nice starterpacks for that.

You'll need:
- Basic solderingskills (plug & play wire harnasses are not common)
- Vtx
- Camera
- Set of good antenna's like bluebeams or Spironets
- Goggles or a monitor

sparkyincali
16th December 2013, 01:45 AM
Correct me if I am wrong but isn't the phantom 2 the vision? It already has the fpv setup built in.

marcus
16th December 2013, 02:06 AM
Videotransmitter frequency depends on the radio you use. If you use a 2.4Ghz radio, the only option for video is 5.8Ghz. RMRC has nice starterpacks for that.

You'll need:
- Basic solderingskills (plug & play wire harnasses are not common)
- Vtx
- Camera
- Set of good antenna's like bluebeams or Spironets
- Goggles or a monitor

Thanks for the information. With the new Phantom, there are AV output and video downlink power cables already installed, so I'm not sure how much modification I'd have to make.

They do sell a 5.8 wireless video kit (http://www.dronefly.com/ProductDetails.asp?ProductCode=Wireless%2DTransmit ter) and a 5.8 wireless monitor (http://www.dronefly.com/ProductDetails.asp?ProductCode=DV05s). However, if I'm reading things correctly, the video receiving max range is 100m...far short of the nearly 1000m range of the Phantom.

Is there something I could do to extend this range?

Thanks!!

marcus
16th December 2013, 02:08 AM
Correct me if I am wrong but isn't the phantom 2 the vision? It already has the fpv setup built in.

This is correct, but a new version will be released in the next few days. The press release is here
http://www.dronefly.com/ProductDetails.asp?ProductCode=P2Gimbal

Any insight you could provide to me for a solid setup?

Thanks!

DiscoTuna
16th December 2013, 05:25 AM
You sold on getting the phantom as your end goal? - many would argue that it is a stepping stone product to things that are more reliable and upgradeable e.g. something that runs off UHF control and 2.4 video which i dont believe that can do (though i might be wrong).

DiscoTuna
16th December 2013, 05:27 AM
For instance that is already on 2.4 control so your only safe option is 5.8 video (that has range and penetration limitations) (as Hans said - missed that).

Sicarius
16th December 2013, 07:24 AM
With some modification, the Phantom could be half-decent, You could stuff an EZUHF in there right? (there's a standard NAZA in the fuselage right?)
Either way, at the heart, even the Phantom is just a quadcopter, you can change hardware.. But i have to agree with DiscoTuna, the end goal should be something with at least replacable arms, and at least 20cm between the VTX and RC Rx areas

Rusty105
16th December 2013, 08:49 AM
If you havent bought the Phantom yet, why not a Flame Wheel f450 , and any other controller, Naze, MultiWii, KK2, APM? Learn to fly a quad before you strap on video equipment. You will crash as you learn!

Coolwaterhubby
20th December 2013, 12:10 PM
I very much would like to start flying fpv after learing the pros and cons of it. Thought about 5.8 ,1.2 and 1.3 set up with my 2.4 radio system. As always iam aware of the draw backs of each. Just trying to get a second opinion of each. If someone would not mind Sharing their knowledge of experience of each it will help me in deciding which system to buy for long range,thank you.

Reliku
20th December 2013, 12:34 PM
Start reading :)

http://fpvlab.com/forums/showthread.php?116-FPV-PILOT-TRAINING-CENTER-YOUR-ROAD-TO-FPV-SUCCESS

sailingeric
20th December 2013, 12:48 PM
as found here http://www.readymaderc.com/store/index.php?main_page=page&id=9

Beyond the arguments and opinions available on the forums, there are some basic rules that you should apply. The most important is that you should NOT use the same frequency for video as you use for RC control. Even if it appears successful for ground testing, you will introduce noise in the video from the RC controller transmissions, and you could lose RC control of your plane once you start flying. Always use a different frequency. Also, regardless of the frequency used, it’s important to have as much distance as possible between your video transmitter and your RC receiver, and ALWAYS perform a range check both before the video equipment is on and after to make sure your RC range hasn’t been significantly affected.

If you are using 2.4GHz for RC control, it’s important to note that you should be using a full range receiver and not a park flyer receiver. For Spektrum, you should be using an AR7000 or higher model. If you are in an area where there will not be interference from 2.4GHz sources such as RC radios, Wifi, or other similar wireless equipment, then often 2.4GHz offers the best picture quality and excellent performance. Most people don’t live in this type of area, so other frequencies may be useful. Here’s a summary of my opinions regarding the various frequencies available:

900MHz: Can offer some of the best range. A wide selection of antennas are available and in most areas it does not have much outside interference. Can penetrate obstacles such as trees and walls better than higher frequencies (but you still should maintain line-of-sight when flying). It may not be legal in some countries, and is restricted to one channel (910MHz) in the US. Some of the antennas can be large because of the wavelength at this frequency. It can cause some servos to jitter due to improper filtering in the servo.

1.2-1.3GHz (1200-1300MHz): Offers excellent range and also seems to be mostly clear of interference in the US and in other countries. Can penetrate obstacles such as trees and walls better than higher frequencies (but you still should maintain line-of-sight when flying). It may not be legal in some countries, and is restricted to one channel (1280MHz) in the US. This is personally my favorite frequency here in the US.

2.4GHz: Offers excellent video quality and sometimes stereo audio depending on the equipment. In areas without interference, 2.4GHz can work amazingly well and is the favorite of many. Although it will penetrate some obstacles, it is absorbed more than some of the lower frequencies and care should be taken to avoid flying behind obstacles. It may receive interference from the abundance of 2.4GHz devices available, and cannot be used with 2.4GHz RC Systems. Some goggles have built in 2.4GHz receivers, which can make an amazingly portable FPV system.

5.8GHz: Has the benefit of using newer technology in the RF module designs similar to 2.4GHz, but there is almost no interference on this frequency band. Very clear video and often stereo audio is included. Will not have the same range given the same power output, but still can be good for flying longer distances with the proper antennas. Will not penetrate obstacles well and the video may go away abruptly if you fly behind a tree. Also seems to be more sensitive to multipath interference in some situations. Some goggles have built in 5.8GHz receivers, which can make an amazingly portable FPV system.

JP1
20th December 2013, 07:24 PM
If your gonna keep the 2.4 remote control then go 5.8 for video. Don't even try 1.2 1.3 with 2.4 control, it will cut your range dramatically. Trust me I checked myself :) Without the range there's no point in using 1.3 in the first place. It seemed awfully silly when I had to lug all the extra gear and set up a ground station receiver on a tripod pole only to be able to fly one or two hundred feet before losing control.

I think 5.8 is still good even if you decide to use 1.3 in the future. 5.8 is simple and compact. with the RX integrated in the goggles you don't have any extra gear to carry/set up. 1.3 means big external receiver, big antennas and ground station setup. When I use 1.3 I still use a 5.8 10mw VTX to relay the signal from the 1.3 receiver to my goggles 5.8 RX. When I use 5.8 VTX I just receive it directly in the goggles and don't need to set up anything.

LManzanares
29th December 2013, 03:54 PM
Is there any benefit to using the 72MHz FM Radio for controlling the aircraft while using FPV systems.
What would be a preferred FPV setup for the FM ?

Reliku
29th December 2013, 09:06 PM
The benefits are:

Better link quality
You'll know when you're out of range before it's too late
2.4 video
Better penetration

squishy
29th December 2013, 10:08 PM
This has been my 1st week flying 72mhz out of my 3 years flying FPV and I'm finding it sucks near the ground beyond a 1/2 mile or so, so all this blabber about 72mhz being great for penetration doesn't mean anything when it fails at low altitudes where penetration means something. Just sayin...

fooyukvoon
29th December 2013, 11:08 PM
Morning everyone,

First post here. Hope someone can answer a problem I am facing with my first FPV setup. I've tried using the search function but the information is just too much to rummage thru even in a week.

I am currently not sure where the problem lies. My setup consists of a TS351 VTX connected to some unknown CCD camera on my Quad. On the receiving side, I have a generic 7" LCD screen with the VRX built into the case. Replaced the antennas with some generic omnidirectional ones.

Have since removed the VRX from the inside of the 7" LCD casing and installed it into an external casing with shielded video connection cables to the LCD screen. Supplying regulated 9V thru a uA7809 Voltage regulator from my car cigarette lighter socket. The VRX is placed on the roof of my car parked on the side of a field.

I am suspecting the poor quality video from the CCD camera and am in the process of looking for a source to buy the SONY Super HAD 600 CCD Camera.

What I cannot understand is why the range is so short. I am getting only about 50' before the LCD display goes all noisy with static.

Is the VRX to blame or the VTX? The VTX looks like the BOSCAM 200W VTX.

Thanks for any replys.

Foo

ipatry
30th December 2013, 10:03 AM
I am new to the site and I have a DJI Phantom v1, and a gopro hero 3. I have the zenmuse gimbal on the phantom as well. Since the wifi of the gopro will interfere with the phantom, I'm looking for the perfect fpv system for the gopro and phantom. I don't want to have to mount an extra battery and I want it to hook directly up to the gopro to line up my shots and such. I was looking at the storm (standard) all-in-one package from helipal.com. I would like it to have a monitor and not goggles because I want to be able to look between the monitor and at the phantom. Now the hard part would be to find something under $275 that still performs well. Thanks in advance!
Isaac

Hans
30th December 2013, 10:16 AM
You'll need 5.8Ghz videotransmission, something like this: http://www.readymaderc.com/store/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=4_318&products_id=2066

Swiss RC
30th December 2013, 10:18 AM
Look for the boscam 200mw Tx/Rx combo from HK, but don't forget to get some cloverleaf antennas...

ipatry
30th December 2013, 10:31 AM
With the boscam, what else do I need?

ipatry
30th December 2013, 10:32 AM
Don't I need a monitor and cables for the gopro and all that?

Swiss RC
30th December 2013, 10:33 AM
Yes you'd need a screen, a gopro cable (very cheap) and a 3s LiPo

Reliku
30th December 2013, 11:02 AM
Low altitude is a different case with 35/72mhz.

Keep in mind, we're talking about radio waves here. And 72mhz has a wavelength of 4 meters (12 feet). That means it's pretty good at punching through stuff, but the "bounce-ability" is pretty low. As you know, 5.8ghz doesn't penetrate well, and bounces off everything. That's due to the short wavelength. As far as I understand it (but I'm probably wrong) that's due to the odds of tunnelling through a barrier for any object reduces when the wavelength reduces. Every object actually has a wavelength (even you, or your chair), but your wavelength is so short you don't tunnel through anything and in essence bounce of everything. Radio waves are at the length that they go through stuff fairly well, compared to IR waves or visual light waves. So let's take a bigger wavelength, like 433mhz. It has decent penetration, but when a barrier is so big that it can't go through, it'll still be able to bounce. With 72 or 35mhz you won't have this effect. If there's a barrier, it'll be able to punch through, but if it's not able to punch through, like with the ground, you'll have no signal anymore.

Also, 433mhz is able to jump through gaps while 72/35mhz is not.

Imagine walking through a house with a 2-feet long stick, and then walking through the same house with a 12 or 24 feet stick. Which is easier? That's the difference between 433mhz and 35/72mhz :)

There are probably people who could explain this better than I can though :p

Reliku
30th December 2013, 11:11 AM
Welcome to the forum :)

Based on your information, I don't know what is at fault. It is definitely not your camera. It could be either your vtx or vrx, keep in mind they could just be on a wrong channel (if the channels are close enough it'll work but not very well). It could also be an antenna issue (a bad antenna will ruin your video quality horribly), and it could also just be interference.

You're on 5.8ghz, so if there's anything solid in between, that could also ruin your video.

Do you have any other components to test with? I'm pretty confident this is either a vtx or vrx issue. Did it work before you removed the vrx from the screen case? And are the antenna's for the right frequency? Start your troubleshooting at the vrx I'd say.

ipatry
30th December 2013, 11:42 AM
Does anyone know anything about the storm all in one package from helipal.com?

Swiss RC
30th December 2013, 12:00 PM
They don't seem too bad, but you'd have to change the antennas (plus 40USD)
But don't fly the phantom, i hate those crafts, i'd rather sell it and buy a real FPV quad like a QAV, or just a Tbs Disco...

Editted by Hans: No Advertising without approval of FPVLab owner.

JP1
30th December 2013, 01:15 PM
Imagine walking through a house with a 2-feet long stick, and then walking through the same house with a 12 or 24 feet stick. Which is easier?

I like that. :)

squishy
30th December 2013, 01:36 PM
Low altitude is a different case with 35/72mhz.

Keep in mind, we're talking about radio waves here. And 72mhz has a wavelength of 4 meters (12 feet). That means it's pretty good at punching through stuff, but the "bounce-ability" is pretty low. As you know, 5.8ghz doesn't penetrate well, and bounces off everything. That's due to the short wavelength. As far as I understand it (but I'm probably wrong) that's due to the odds of tunnelling through a barrier for any object reduces when the wavelength reduces. Every object actually has a wavelength (even you, or your chair), but your wavelength is so short you don't tunnel through anything and in essence bounce of everything. Radio waves are at the length that they go through stuff fairly well, compared to IR waves or visual light waves. So let's take a bigger wavelength, like 433mhz. It has decent penetration, but when a barrier is so big that it can't go through, it'll still be able to bounce. With 72 or 35mhz you won't have this effect. If there's a barrier, it'll be able to punch through, but if it's not able to punch through, like with the ground, you'll have no signal anymore.

Also, 433mhz is able to jump through gaps while 72/35mhz is not.

Imagine walking through a house with a 2-feet long stick, and then walking through the same house with a 12 or 24 feet stick. Which is easier? That's the difference between 433mhz and 35/72mhz :)

There are probably people who could explain this better than I can though :p

That is some of the best stuff I have read here on the lab, too bad it's now buried in a thread title "fpv" on a website called FPVlab...like derrrrrr...right?
Thanks for the explanation. It appears all roads lead back to 433mhz for control...

squishy
30th December 2013, 02:11 PM
You need to spend about 40+ hours reading and searching these forums. If you just end up with more questions, keep searching till they are answered. Do not buy anything until you have done your homework..

gOwenMyWay
30th December 2013, 02:59 PM
I would go with Hans' suggestion if I had a Phantom. Everything you need (well maybe an LC filter http://www.readymaderc.com/store/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=11_66_68&products_id=533). Plus my personal experience with that dealer is nothing short of amazing. I have one of those xmitters hooked to a GoPro and it works really well (and charges the GoPro!). All you have to do is find a safe way to tap into the flight battery.

Reliku
30th December 2013, 09:04 PM
433mhz is a good compromise between bounceability and penetrateability, which is why it's the best choice. In theory, every frequency should be capable of the same range if in a vacuum, but in practical situations 433mhz is often the best bet :)

fooyukvoon
30th December 2013, 09:30 PM
Hi,

Thanks for the reply. I am on 5.8Ghz. I took out the VRX from the LCD casing because of the poor range and intermittent blinking (not sure if that's the right term to use :) ) The last test I did was in an open field near a stadium.

You mentioned about channels being a possibility. Maybe I'll give that a try. It is currently on channel 1 (I presume, cos both the DIP switches are set the same though they are not of the same manufacturer)

I'll retry with the original antenna first on both the VTX n VRX.

My guess is that the Camera is the reason for the poor display and the VRX for the poor range. :)

Thanks again.

Foo

Reliku
31st December 2013, 11:12 AM
The poor display is the camera's fault. The range however, is the vtx or vrx.

If they're not from the same manufacturer, there is a possibility they're not on the same channel set. For example: Lawmate equipment on 2.4ghz generally goes in steps of 20mhz, so 2410mhz, 2430mhz, 2450mhz and so on.
Fat shark airwave 2.4ghz equipment goes in steps of 18mhz, they use 2414mhz, 2432mhz, 4250mhz and 4268mhz. If your receiver is on 2430mhz and your transmitter is on 2432mhz, you'll have a picture, but it'll crumble with some distance.

The same goes for fat shark // immersionrc gear versus boscam gear on the 5.8 band. They both take steps of 10mhz, but boscam-like gear has for example 5885mhz, while fat shark // imrc has 5880mhz.

If they're close, it'll work, but you won't have an image.

As for your camera, get one of these:
http://www.securitycamera2000.com/products/RunCam-600TVL-Plastic-Housing-FPV-Camera.html?utm_source=test+group&utm_campaign=4c37b7fc5c-Weekly_Deal_on_2013_12_2012_20_2013&utm_medium=email&utm_term=0_cdb94eb15f-4c37b7fc5c-93065733&ct=t(Weekly_Deal_on_2013_12_2012_20_2013)&goal=0_cdb94eb15f-4c37b7fc5c-93065733&mc_cid=4c37b7fc5c&mc_eid=b7168b0c38

IBCrazy
31st December 2013, 12:44 PM
This has been my 1st week flying 72mhz out of my 3 years flying FPV and I'm finding it sucks near the ground beyond a 1/2 mile or so, so all this blabber about 72mhz being great for penetration doesn't mean anything when it fails at low altitudes where penetration means something. Just sayin...
It's all about knowing how to run your antennas and turn off your failsafes. Watch my videos and see what 72 MHz can do:

Inner city building surfing across a river:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1Thlo56MiRU

Low altitude tree dodging through a forest (behind a hill too):

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ymd2CDM1T8Q

You can't fly any lower than this (and UHF won't do this either):

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZFdYbGEUWBo

72MHz done right is awesome. I've been flying it for years.

-Alex

squishy
31st December 2013, 12:46 PM
This is what I was doing, note the RSSI it loves to drop as I get lower...


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PhNnY_rLJ5A

Reliku
31st December 2013, 12:50 PM
Alex, you generally need to horizontally polarize your antenna's on 35/72 right? (due to antenna size)

By the way, was my statement correct that you get fresnel zone's more easily on 72/35? I'm not 100% sure on it, I'm no radio engineer lol.

squishy
31st December 2013, 01:00 PM
I ran my antenna on my wing like so:

38009

and because of that I hold my TX with the antenna horizontal along the ground. I sit in a chair though and it's only a few feet off the ground.

I heard you can put a 72mhz antenna on top of a 10 foot pole and get like 10 miles, but how does one go about modding that? I am not an IBcrazy and wouldn't even know what kind of cable to use..maybe you should make me one Alex and if it works well, sell them...I already have a break-down fiberglass pole I fly the jolly roger on, would be easy to strap a special 72mhz antenna up there...
Hey what gives anyway, you fly 72, but make custom 433 antenna like the turnstile...come on dude, I may be new to 72 but give us some love..

gOwenMyWay
31st December 2013, 01:17 PM
I think it is due to the cumbersome size which reduces it's practicality.

Reliku
31st December 2013, 02:34 PM
Squishy, try running your antenna in a straight line, and if necessary just let the rest hang from the wing tip. If you horizontally polarize your tx antenna as well you should be fairly good. Either way, running in a circle is not a good idea I'd say. But again, I'm no radio engineer.

fooyukvoon
31st December 2013, 08:48 PM
Was fiddling with the vrx freq switches yesterday, and it seems there were 3 possible positions that worked. Left the vtx switches untouched. Gonna try outdoors later today.

Gonna try ordering that camera tomorrow.

Happy New Year everyone.

Foo

Dust
1st January 2014, 09:38 PM
You need to spend about 40+ hours reading and searching these forums. If you just end up with more questions, keep searching till they are answered. Do not buy anything until you have done your homework..

+1 this! ^^

Flyswamper
2nd January 2014, 05:45 PM
Hi folks,

Another newbie/wannabe fpv flier here. Sitting here on a ipad for a few days and helping take care of my father-in-law in his last days. Of course appreciate any kind words but I'm writing due to a lot of time on my hands and sitting here thinking about what I ought to do next in my growth in the fpv world.

Of course before you could suggest what is next, I better try to summarize where I'm at now so here goes....attempting to be brief!

Started rc flying one year ago with a super cub. Totally self taught never been to a club. Used phoenix4 simulator a lot especially in first couple of months.

Fast forward to today.... I have 2 super cubs, an apprentice s15e, a delta ray, a blade nano qx, a blade 120sr heli, and a blade 350qx quad. As you see most of these are beginner type of aircraft many with the SAFE technology. With that said I'm very comfortable flying with the safe stuffed turned off.

Once I get back home in a week or so....... Going to be putting together a speed build kit for the Versawing that the guys from Flitetest.com puts out. My thought is to fly it line of sight for enough time that I'm very comfortable with how it flies (probably a couple weeks worth of evening and weekend flights out my backyard)

Next step is to install the 5.8ghz starter fpv kit from readymaderc that is supposedly waiting at my home post office for me (I'd have by now except for the hospice care situation). Plan to fly well within Los range for a bit then work out a bit further.....,which is where my questions and soliciting your thoughts come in....

I currently am using a dx9 spectrum 2.4ghz for control. Fully realize this won't do for longer range that I want to get to. Eventually will go with ezuhf for control (my ham was published a day or so ago....yippee!). And expect to also get a 1.2ghz video setup from readymaderc too

I suppose if I have a specific question it would be what sort of range might I get with my dx9 while I'm still using my 5.8ghz video system and taking baby steps?

Also just would appreciate words of wisdom and suggestions.....

Looks like I might have posted this in wrong section....apologies...not used to doing this from the ipad yet...please move to appropriate place if needed.

Flyswamper
2nd January 2014, 05:54 PM
Fwiw....here is the fpv starter kit details that is waiting on me at the post office ( I hope it waits there long enough)

1 xCustom FatShark Goggles FPV Starter Package: 5.8GHz (5.8GHZGOGGLESPACKAGE-CUSTOM)
Antennas Bluebeam Whip Set
Camera RMRC-700XV NTSC
Video Transmitter FatShark 250mW 5.8GHz
FatShark Attitude Goggles (Bonus 5.8G TX)
OSD None

Kfactor
2nd January 2014, 08:31 PM
Need some help with my first setup I was thinking of going with the dominator goggles with ether the tbs Dominator rx with the tbs rookie 200 mw or the Immersion UNO 5800 5.8 Duel out put and make a ground station with the immersion 600mw Tx what would be a better set up with in crazy wipes

Kfactor
6th January 2014, 08:41 PM
Any one . I just want to know if I'm wasting my money and if I should go with somthing differnt

BrittMac
6th January 2014, 08:55 PM
I love my Domi's. I went with the newest 5.8 module I could get. I order a lot from readymaderc, but they were out of Vrx's at the time and I got mine from hobbywireless (not a bad alternate at all). Great combo, no issues with the goggles thus far. I have a IMRC Duo also for a GS, but I find that I like to keep it simple usually and just use the goggles.


As far as Vtx's, If you aren't planning on flying 3 or more miles with 5.8, the 200mw should do well if you get some decent antennas on it and the Vrx. Don't skimp on the antenna, they are more important than the transmitting power of the Vtx. Really. You can use TBS stuff, or use FatShark 250mw and IMRC for the Vrx in the goggles. All up to you. It should serve you well.


BUT, let us know what kind of flying you are wanting to do, and it would help. Low, high, fast, slow, planes, multi's, heli's, you get the drill.

Kfactor
6th January 2014, 09:48 PM
Thanks for the reply and I'm flying a tbs disco with Naza m light . I wanted to go with ether 900 MHz or 1.3 but dont got the money for a UHF stuff and for my first fpv I just wanted somthing simple for now . For now I just want to fly mid hight and slower and I was going to hook the dominators up to the duo if that's possible and use the power from that to power the goggles and what not

BrittMac
6th January 2014, 10:44 PM
Okay then. Well, you can use the same power source for both the Duo and the goggles since both of them will run off of 3s batteries. You can solder up a simple harness that splits the one battery output into two barrel plugs. Just make sure you have the proper barrel plug.


Honestly, if you are using 2.4 for control, then you can use 5.8 for video. You should have no issues at all because you aren't going to be flying 3 miles with the Disco. You can easily hook up the Domi's to the Duo. There is a switch on the bottom of the Domi's that will make the goggle's go from the internal Vrx, to utilize an external Rx. No biggie.
I forgot to ask if you were in the U.S. or not. If you are, then stay away from 900mhz. Too many 900mhz sources here.


Any more questions, keep them coming. I'm about to sack out, but maybe someone else will chime in tonight if you have any more questions.


Edit: I put the switch comment about the Duo instead of Domi's. Fixed.

Kfactor
6th January 2014, 11:42 PM
Thanks for the help and all the info and I'm sure all have more questions lol

Hans
16th January 2014, 04:29 PM
This thread has now become the main Beginners Questions - Thread. All topics regarding this question about starting with FPV will be merged into this one.

pauldhook
20th January 2014, 01:05 PM
I've got some beginner questions. I haven't purchased any equipment yet, so I'm basically learning about the technology at this point.

1. If you have return to home capability, does this simply turn the plane around so it travels on a level flight path in the direction of home so that when it gets back into range you can regain control of the plane?

2. What does "stabilization" mean? I hear this term thrown around in OSD and RTH discussions.

3. Suppose you have RTH, which is tied to a GPS. You go out of range, RTH is triggered but something goes wrong and the plane crashes into some woods. Is there a way to figure out where the plane went down based on its last GPS transmission?

ProtoCrash
20th January 2014, 01:19 PM
Hi Paukhook, welcome to the addiction...

1) There are many systems, some of which can even land the plane (I think Ruby does this). However, all RTH systems, as a minimum, will turn the plane round, bring it over your head (or close enough) and then circle overhead. Note that some of them need some serious trial and error to actually get them to work
2) Simply, a system that keeps your plane flying straight. It gets plugged between your control receiver and your servos. Some systems can switch modes mid-flight and support the pilot in doing some funky stuff (e.g. keep the plane in hover or doing a knives edge). The reason you've read stabiliation alongside RTH is that in most cases (i.e. unless your plane self-corrects) you'll need the stabiliser to keep it nice and level while the RTH turns it around
3) Many ways... Most FPV pilots have an on screen display. This can show your coordinates. You then record the video during the flight and if you lose signal you can rewind and see the last coordinates. You can also use a UHF beacon (I'm a big fan of fmkit's beacon) or more specialised telemetry systems

BUT... as many people here have said in the past... its usually better, safer, cheaper, more likely to be a success if you start simple and build up. If your first FPV plane has all the gadgets on the market then it will probably never take off :)

Good luck!

fooyukvoon
20th January 2014, 10:08 PM
Hi all,

Back again. Looking at display options. What is the best for a person with glasses? I am planning to use a 7" LCD screen for the time being but the display becomes useless in the bright outdoors. Hv been tinkering with shades and boxes to improve the display. And also a tripod to hold it while I fly. :(.

I've read something about lenses which can be attached to goggles for us visually impaired flyers. Not much info about which brands have them and how to select the lenses.

Anyone out there can help?

Thanks.

Foo

BrittMac
20th January 2014, 11:17 PM
Foo, I am not 100%, but, you could probably use a regular set of goggles and do the ski-goggle mod. I hope someone else here will speak up as well, however, my buddy has done the goggle-mod and there is an obvious difference in the feeling of the goggle on your face.

fooyukvoon
20th January 2014, 11:20 PM
BrittMac,

Do you mean attaching the LCD to a pair of goggles?

http://static.rcgroups.net/forums/attachments/3/8/9/3/5/a5100714-123-helmet%20fpv.jpg?d=1345601950

Foo

OhmEye
20th January 2014, 11:40 PM
Goggles for people who wear glasses are usually not a problem. I am very nearsighted. If you are farsighted, you should be fine with goggles and no correction lenses (called diopters) since the goggles use lenses that simulate a large screen several feet away. If you are nearsighted and need glasses to see farther than a few feet, you need to buy or make diopters, which are lenses that slide in front of the goggle lenses. Fatshark goggles (and probably most others) have them available and a slot they slide into.

However, unless your prescription is pretty simple with no astigmatism they won't work as well as your glasses and may be annoying. Instead of buying the set of Fatshark diopters I made my own from some cheap glasses made for my exact prescription. It was even cheaper than buying the $20 diopter set and works much better. I did a photo tutorial of what I did at http://ohmeye.smugmug.com/Hobbies/FPV/Fatshark-Attitude-DIY-Diopters/32898245_KbMjQn

The biggest inconvenience for me is that I have to change between glasses and goggles which isn't as easy as launching the plane and just dropping the goggles off my forehead over my eyes. But That's no big deal really. And of course, nobody else can see well in my goggles except me, unless they have a similar prescription. But my goggles are MINE and I'm to selfish to share so no problem. :) The lenses I made easily slide out, it's not a permanent mod at all. I did put in a bit of tacky clay or tape to make sure they don't accidentally slide out but that is all.

fooyukvoon
21st January 2014, 12:32 AM
Just back from your link. Interesting idea.

palacita
23rd January 2014, 05:46 AM
Hi,

I need some advice for choice an good frequency for medium and long range with the minimal altitude from ground at 200m.

Is the 1G2 or 2G4 and what best tuned band with less interference will, also the antenna type each band?

thank you

Sicarius
23rd January 2014, 07:30 AM
This is not a good question. There are no "best" in RF frequencies, each frequency has it's pro's and cons, which you can look up and has been written numerous times across the forum.
You may also want to look up things like "reflection" and "harmonics" in RF, these have a large effect on the combinations of control and video frequencies you use.
Start with a standard plane/quadcopter and go fly Line of Sight for a while before you even try FPV, let alone LR FPV. It'll cost marginally more, but the experience will be very rewarding towards your final goal, and it will save you money times a lot if you know what you're buying.

ProtoCrash
23rd January 2014, 09:01 AM
Palacita, check out the beginner's training section on the lab. Alex (IBCrazy) has done some awesome tutorial videos that cover your questions exactly.

palacita
24th January 2014, 11:07 AM
Palacita, check out the beginner's training section on the lab. Alex (IBCrazy) has done some awesome tutorial videos that cover your questions exactly.

Thank you ProtoCrash

georgios21
24th January 2014, 07:52 PM
Tbs disco can't go wrong

andione1983
26th January 2014, 10:29 PM
Any FPV Multi-Rotor guys out there, i get so confused when it comes to this stuff
Advice appreciated.
I have been flying helis for the last couple of years, and my mates quads are really inspiring me to get into FPV.... after wearing a pair of Fatsharks.. is quite enjoyable compared to flying Helis.. can be stressful..
Every time i try and consider buying one i get scared off because of so many options out there.
So im thinking DJI stuff might be the way to go cause its easy and comes all in bundles.
I am used to setting Helis up using Wizards and so on, so DJI seems like the most likely option for me, i honestly would rather be flying that tweaking all the time, like i have heard from my mates in regards to Multiwii, and the HK KK boards etc.


First up im thinking this kit
DJI 450 with Naza V2, GPS and basic Motor/ESC
Is this a good value option?
Or should i buy my bits seperately.. like a motor set/ esc set/// or are the DJI combo bits going to do me fine?
http://www.rc711.com/shop/dji-flame...ding-skid-combo-p-8486.html?cPath=341_378_391 (http://www.rc711.com/shop/dji-flame-wheel-f450-quadcopter-arf-kitnazam-v2-gpszenmuse-h32dlanding-skid-combo-p-8486.html?cPath=341_378_391)

When it comes to the FPV link side of things i see there seems to be around 3-4 major players

1. Boscam

2. Dji

3. Fatshark


probably others that im not away of

At this early stage, i will not use a UHF link, i will master the 5.8 video link first, and get my fpv flying fine tuned.

so for example
This is the DJI TX/RX combo which has antennas and the links included

http://www.rc711.com/shop/dji-avl58...f-antenna-free-ship-p-8159.html?cPath=383_384 (http://www.rc711.com/shop/dji-avl58-58g-video-downlink-500mw-transmitterreceiverclover-leaf-antenna-free-ship-p-8159.html?cPath=383_384)

Then i would need a screen at the receiving end or goggles etc..
This one below has the included camera.
(one thing to note i have a Go pro hero 3 already, any way to use that as a broadcasting device to get the pictures to the goggles? )

http://www.rc711.com/shop/fatshark-attitude-v2-fpv-headset-p-8645.html?cPath=383_384


I am highly considering the TBS Core and upgrade if i go the DJI 450 option.
The 450 option from RC 711 seems to be a good value pack as you get the Naza M V2, also the Giball for Go pro , (i have a Hero 3 ready to do)

other option could be a

UAV400
http://www.getfpv.com/multi-rotor-frames/qav400-fpv-quad.html

I see some good reviews on this set up.


Cheers for any info you can give me
Andrew.

shaunmed
27th January 2014, 02:17 PM
Ultimate beginner FPV parts list


After carefully going through the introduction pages of this site and trying to research my question I was unable to find the answer so here I am.

There is a huge thread on "what you would do differently if you were to start over in FPV" and one of the most common things is that people didn't chose the right set up to begin with. The problem is no one then replies with a correct or good enough list!

So please list a good beginner set up at a reasonable price (~$300) for the FPV portion ie video transmitter/ receiver and all accompanying required hardware including appropriate wires, batteries and LCD. The vehicle (I have a Blade 350 QX), its transmitter (I have a DX6i), camera (I use a sony action cam and gopro) and gimbal (I use a chepo Ebay gimbal) are NOT important, only the hardware required to transmit and receive/ record the video feed.

Many thanks from all us newbies hoping to get into the field.

ProtoCrash
27th January 2014, 02:51 PM
Hey Shaunmend,

The reason why there is no definitive list is that the list depends on loads of things, including, importantly, what it is you want to achieve, what your longer term plans are and what your existing equipment is.

I'll give you an example: Your DX6i is a 2.4 Tx. That rules out 2.4 for video and leaves 900, 1.2 and 5.8. However 900 may be illegal or unusable in your location (used for mobile phones). 1.2 gives you good range but huge antennas. So many people go 5.8 for video. However... if you're in this for the long game then the advice may change... ditch 2.4 for control and invest in a UHF module for control. In which case 2.4 for video is now a (good) option.

I suggest you do some more research. If you want some ready made examples check out the ready made packages that vendors sell (I think TBS, readymadeRC and firstpersonview.co.uk have some options), check out other peoples' posts about their setup etc. Also, (and this is a shameful plug but I do think it would be useful), you could checkout the beginners guide to FPV (book or ebook) where I list in detail (including schematics) my first setup and then how I built it to where I am today...

Best of luck

danc516
28th January 2014, 12:40 AM
hi guys,

i've got a new 2.3/2.4 video setup for my tbs caipiriha and looking for some help on troubleshooting it.. i'm not getting any image.

http://i863.photobucket.com/albums/ab200/Dan_Cheung/24videotxandrx_zps97698287.jpg

SecurityCamera2000 PZ0420
RMRC 2.3-2.4GHz 200mW 4 Channel Video Transmitter
2.3-2.4GHz Receiver (14 Channel)
TBS Core PNP25
3S batteries
IBCrazy 2.3 specific antennas

I've confirmed the camera is getting 12V from the TBS Core and the VTX is getting 5V. I feel the transmitter gets slightly warm so i know it's getting juice.. and the receiver is definitely on since i can cycle through the channels.

I follow the directions on RMRC and set the VTX channel to match the Receiver Channel.. and i get absolutely nothing. I've hooked the video output to both my fatshark predators and my tv and neither are working.. any ideas how i solve this issue?

thanks a million!
dan

RonSII
28th January 2014, 03:58 AM
Hi Dan, does it make a difference in the receiver when you turn off the transmitter?


hi guys,

i've got a new 2.3/2.4 video setup for my tbs caipiriha and looking for some help on troubleshooting it.. i'm not getting any image.


SecurityCamera2000 PZ0420
RMRC 2.3-2.4GHz 200mW 4 Channel Video Transmitter
2.3-2.4GHz Receiver (14 Channel)
TBS Core PNP25
3S batteries
IBCrazy 2.3 specific antennas

I've confirmed the camera is getting 12V from the TBS Core and the VTX is getting 5V. I feel the transmitter gets slightly warm so i know it's getting juice.. and the receiver is definitely on since i can cycle through the channels.

I follow the directions on RMRC and set the VTX channel to match the Receiver Channel.. and i get absolutely nothing. I've hooked the video output to both my fatshark predators and my tv and neither are working.. any ideas how i solve this issue?

thanks a million!
dan

ProtoCrash
28th January 2014, 11:42 AM
Hi Dan,

A few thoughts and things to checkout:
1) To check your cam is working OK you could hook it up direct with your screen and see if it displays OK. Also check you're sending you video channel and not your audio channel to your Tx
2) Classic issue: are you sure your Tx and Rx have a common channel? (i.e. a specific frequency in 2.3-2.4 range that they both tune to)
3) In case there's something dodgy with the core you could connect the cam direct to the Tx (just the signal) and see if that works

Be very careful with your voltages in all of the above!
A

danc516
28th January 2014, 11:49 PM
Hi Dan, does it make a difference in the receiver when you turn off the transmitter?

Hi Ron- i accidentally killed my fatshark goggle battery by leaving it plugged in so i only have my tv which shows a blue screen without any input. should i see a change in the fuzzy noise if it was somewhat transmitting?


Hi Dan,

A few thoughts and things to checkout:
1) To check your cam is working OK you could hook it up direct with your screen and see if it displays OK. Also check you're sending you video channel and not your audio channel to your Tx
2) Classic issue: are you sure your Tx and Rx have a common channel? (i.e. a specific frequency in 2.3-2.4 range that they both tune to)
3) In case there's something dodgy with the core you could connect the cam direct to the Tx (just the signal) and see if that works

Be very careful with your voltages in all of the above!
A

thanks for these suggestions! i'll defintely give them a try. the plugs are totally different that those of my 5.8ghz immersion rc setup otherwise it would be so easy to test each component. i guess i'll have to to some wire cutting to test..

i've double and triple checked that the channels match.. so i feel like maybe it is the core..

thanks to both for the input!

RonSII
28th January 2014, 11:56 PM
Hi Ron- i accidentally killed my fatshark goggle battery by leaving it plugged in so i only have my tv which shows a blue screen without any input. should i see a change in the fuzzy noise if it was somewhat transmitting?



thanks for these suggestions! i'll defintely give them a try. the plugs are totally different that those of my 5.8ghz immersion rc setup otherwise it would be so easy to test each component. i guess i'll have to to some wire cutting to test..

i've double and triple checked that the channels match.. so i feel like maybe it is the core..

thanks to both for the input!

sorry to hear about the FS batt, there is a thread on here somewhere about recovering those... I think you hook a 9volt batt to it for a second or so to reset the batts memory then you should be able to charge it regularly.

you should be able to get some really small 26-30 gauge wire and just bare the ends of it and use as a jumper into the plugs so no wire/plug cutting needed to tset if the cam is giving video.

danc516
29th January 2014, 12:39 AM
sorry to hear about the FS batt, there is a thread on here somewhere about recovering those... I think you hook a 9volt batt to it for a second or so to reset the batts memory then you should be able to charge it regularly.

you should be able to get some really small 26-30 gauge wire and just bare the ends of it and use as a jumper into the plugs so no wire/plug cutting needed to tset if the cam is giving video.

awesome, many thanks!

RonSII
29th January 2014, 12:49 AM
Here on page 7 of the manual for the goggles it tells about the 9volt battery trick.

http://www.fatshark.com/uploads/pdf/1719-1.pdf (http://www.fatshark.com/uploads/pdf/1719-1.pdf)

danc516
29th January 2014, 02:30 AM
Here on page 7 of the manual for the goggles it tells about the 9volt battery trick.

http://www.fatshark.com/uploads/pdf/1719-1.pdf (http://www.fatshark.com/uploads/pdf/1719-1.pdf)

The 9v reset worked like a charm. Thanks for the info!

danc516
29th January 2014, 06:45 PM
thanks for the help guys- of course is was pure user error. i assumed the 4 wire tbs video cable plugged into the matching port on the back of the fpv cam. i'm not sure what the 4 pin port is for on the back of the camera but it doesn't output video.. the cam came with a 3 wire cable that i mated to my 4 wire tbs cable (i guess the 4th wire is for audio). bingo.. we have video! i love the fact that my fs battery is back in business too!

thanks again!
dan

RonSII
29th January 2014, 06:49 PM
Great!!!, glad to hear it is sorted :) at least it was something simple and not bad hardware.

CaptainJustice
31st January 2014, 09:50 AM
@squishy. Look here:http://fpvlab.com/forums/archive/index.php/t-2884.html?
A dipole is a basic but good antenna design. Just figure out how to support the horizontal wires. It is slightly directional off of the sides perpendicular to the direction the antenna lays.

Johnny-Five
3rd February 2014, 03:43 PM
Hello everyone, I would like to know what components to use on a Walkera QR x350
I would like to set it up for the best all around FPV flying. I understand there are always give and take but would appreciate something middle of the road with head tracking. Is this possible? Also what is the preferred transmitter? Is Walkera's transmitter that is in the RTF package compatible? Thanks in advance for any advice,
Johnny-Five

IBCrazy
4th February 2014, 12:28 AM
Walkera's FPV stuff is pretty much crap. They wanted me to review it on my YouTube channel and after testing it I informed them that they do not want me reviewing it. it is better to get an FPV system that is known and goo for micros. RMRC sell some micro low power stuff. Also the TBS Greenhorn and the RMRC micro camera would do well together.

-Alex

ProtoCrash
4th February 2014, 05:33 AM
Alex, I'd only make one comment here - perhaps walkera stuff isnt good in most cases but the ladybird (suuuper small quad) is excellent. Of course you never expect or need much range from those little beasts but their stability is really good.

LVNeptune
12th February 2014, 01:09 AM
Kind of related and a funny story. Just started out with R/C and FPV in general. The first goggles I buy are cinemizer mods from FPV-Plastics. Long story short. USPS messed up and shipped my goggles to IBCrazy. I probably never would have found out where they were except someone noticed the city, state as the same as IBCrazy and sure enough he had them :D

Interesting how such a small knit group we are.

IBCrazy
12th February 2014, 11:52 AM
Alex, I'd only make one comment here - perhaps walkera stuff isnt good in most cases but the ladybird (suuuper small quad) is excellent. Of course you never expect or need much range from those little beasts but their stability is really good.
I was only referring to their FPV gear. I too have a LadyBird quad and I love it. Flies great. A bit unstable, but not bad.

-Alex

Thomashamka
16th February 2014, 08:03 AM
Hello everybody!

I noticed a cool set at youtube: http://www.youtube.com/user/RoadTripFPV/about

As a new to FPV i would like to know would this setup be good? (Though I would like to use fat shark). Ground station looks good, but the copter needs to have more lipos.

Thanks!

UAVT
20th February 2014, 02:06 PM
I just flew my first FPV flight today, semi successfully.

I was flying no more than 200m away from myself, and I got RSSI warnings.

Here's my setup- I tried to keep it as simple as possible.
Hawk sky airframe
400mw 1258 MHz vTx with rubber ducky antenna and 1.3/2.4 notch filter
3 cell lipo flight battery with tap & LC filter
Sony super had ii camera
Frsky D8R-XP

Here's a pic-
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-FjeGiEgvpJs/UwQPNvTQVqI/AAAAAAAAAh4/whlowrj54kw/w1027-h577-no/IMG_20140218_205549822.jpg


I'm guessing the problem is the separation of video Tx and control RX (or lack thereof) but putting the TX out further is going to be a PIA and I decided it would be best to confirm first.

Unrelated- My video had some bad glitches- Hoping to solve that problem next.

sgtsmall
20th February 2014, 04:07 PM
You should look at swapping the location of tx and rx. The camera and other components are going to be messy for your rx it is trying to receive a tiny signal at this point and what you seem to have is a high "noise Floor" surrounding it.

UAVT
25th February 2014, 11:30 PM
I moved the vTx to the canopy and the receiver to under the wing on the bottom of the fuse. Original range tests yielded 42 rssi at 30m- after moving the vTx and receiver, I got 40+. Winds have kept me grounded since, but I have a window of low winds tomorrow morning. Will report back. Thanks!

LVNeptune
25th February 2014, 11:32 PM
2.4 is trash with 1.2/1.3 even with a filter...You will always have significantly reduced range. I can fly around a local park no problem but I go behind my house with 1.3 and 2.4 on and all hell breaks loose, I can't use it 30 feet in front of me LOL. DTF UHF coming tomorrow :)

UAVT
26th February 2014, 12:28 PM
There are people who have used it successfully.

Unfortunately, my alarm clock died on me this morning and by the time I was up the wind had picked up. Shoot.

LVNeptune
26th February 2014, 12:35 PM
Oh I don't doubt it. Worked great for me one day, then just crap after that :(


Looks to be best practice to have your video on a higher frequency than your RC no matter what frequencies you are using.

UAVT
26th February 2014, 01:10 PM
Yeah, I've read the FAQ. I plan to move to a LRS someday, so 1.3 was the best choice for me. I don't mind the extra work to get it working right.

Sicarius
27th February 2014, 01:42 AM
There is no 'extra work' involved.. 2.4 range isn't spectacular as it is, but when you add a strong transmitter, that runs on the first harmonic frequency of 2.4, you'll have range issues. You can do a lot to reduce it, but you'll never get the same range or reliability.

UAVT
27th February 2014, 09:05 AM
There is no 'extra work' involved.. 2.4 range isn't spectacular as it is, but when you add a strong transmitter, that runs on the first harmonic frequency of 2.4, you'll have range issues. You can do a lot to reduce it, but you'll never get the same range or reliability.

Tomato, Tomato, Potato Potato. I don't mean to sound rude, but there's not much I can do now.

In other news, I flew a flight this morning- no Rssi warning, actually, pretty solid rssi the whole flight.

Now I want to tackle my video issue. While flying with my patch, I got horizontal distortion in some areas of the sky but not others. After switching to a rubber ducky, I got the same distortion.
The distortion appears similar to the distortion in this video, although there are no horizontal lines in my video feed. I will get out the easycap and try to video the problem.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dXhNQGxzyMM

UAVT
27th February 2014, 12:00 PM
"My car is making a horrible sound!"
"Can you show me?"
Starts car and the car sounds fine
"Shoot."

I flew a los flight with easycap, and the problem doesn't seem to show itself as often as I've experienced it. Here's the video.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H6UUt7LLpEM&feature=youtu.be

The problem does appear, seems to be while the power lines are between the plane and me?

sgtsmall
27th February 2014, 04:00 PM
Signal performance outside - Moisture in the air and around powerlines particularly will create some of the problem. However first you should check some geometry...
Fly towards you, away, rolled at a series of angles. ie you are looking to see if there is something on the build that is creating a signal barrier. (battery, servos etc.)

Same on the ground the position of radio Tx, Vid Rx and flight. (is one in front of the other.)
You can also achieve this with a buddy and some handy talkies or equivalent!!
If you are using the verticals giving the vid Rx antenna some space from your radio Tx can help even an extra metre vertically. (light weight pole with Rx/antenna up 2-3 metres)

Flyswamper
28th February 2014, 06:03 PM
Here's a newbie question I have..

I am setup with 8-ch ezUHF (with diversity) RX and also ezOSD. The RSSI data that I see coming through the video gives me RSSI values that are close to zero when the TX and RX are sitting close and the signal is near perfect. It appears the RSSI values that are displayed increase as the signal gets weaker.

This surprised me as I was under the (uneducated) view that the RSSI values that would be shown would be a high value (perhaps 100 if it is a 0-100% type of scale) when the signal is perfect and would drop to a lower value when the signal/reception was being degraded.

Anyone want to elaborate on this? Or is there nothing to elaborate on and it's just a case of whatever I read on the forums ....I obviously failed to understand/interpret it correctly.

LVNeptune
28th February 2014, 06:11 PM
I know some model RX's, can't speak for that specifically, output INVERTED signals where 100% = .3v or something similar and 0% = 3.3v ... Not sure if this is true in your case.

Flyswamper
28th February 2014, 08:33 PM
Well... I've read just enough to be dangerous with ideas and opinions on it. But I have some suspicion that it has to do with it being a digital RSSI signal as opposed to an analog voltage based one. But...again... I don't know what the heck I'm talking about here and was curious.

LVNeptune
28th February 2014, 09:44 PM
That could be it as well but usually you would get variable readings, not reversed readings...

Flyswamper
7th March 2014, 11:56 PM
Newbie trying to learn question here....


I have ezUHF 8ch with diversity RX. Here is a scan using ImmersionRCtools. The conditions are ...


plane sitting on kitchen table, perhaps 2 feet away from laptop.
USB cable plugged into ezUHF RX.
Nothing else powered on the plane.


The scan results look like what you see in the attached file...


My question is.... is this a lot of "noise floor" and should I be concerned?

IBCrazy
8th March 2014, 01:57 AM
^Try this outside. The graph shows significantly reduced range capabilities.

-Alex

sgtsmall
8th March 2014, 04:46 AM
yep sort of.... first of all all these signals are the first thing... as Alex highlights try this in a clean area (park, field etc.) and see if you can get the line much flatter, without tx on. (may need to move pc around a bit to see if it is contributing any noise). Then turn on Tx and you should get a distinctive signal show up. indicating frequency and strength, then take the tx for a walk ... 50 yards should do and look at that one.
From this diagram I will describe a bit of the floor concept. between 433.5 and 434.5 the signal ranges roughly between -100 and -96. For your signal to get through at 433.5 it would have to be -98 or better, if at 433.8 you would have to better than -95 to be above the noise. To be usable you would probably need a bit more than that, but that is the starting concept.

So now imagine you have something on the model generating even a "tiny signal (noise is just signals you don't want!)" this would potentially start raising that floor further.
Once you get some relatively clear data above you should be able to start turning on other bits to look for the noise.
let us know how you go.

Flyswamper
8th March 2014, 01:46 PM
Ok, thanks fellas... A week or two ago I ran the ImmersionRCTools interference wizard and recorded all that data and saved it to a spreadsheet for plotting. If memory serves, the base-line scan didn't appear quite as bad as the one I showed you guys. When I get a chance I'll see about dragging the laptop outdoors and seeing what it looks like in the backyard. From your comments it sounds like the ideal test would be to "get out of suburbia" and do a test. I am probably headed to Corpus Christi next weekend for some windsurfing and beach time. Will take a plane or two as well as my laptop, so maybe I can do some testing out there (I think the Padre Island National Seashore is relatively quiet from RF...just guessing through).


I'll be flying with my 5.8Ghz setup out over the water a bit. Made some more flights with my Penguin from RMRC this morning and now that I've got most of the bugs out of the setup and got it balanced/trimmed pretty good I am REALLY loving flying this Penguin. I've got 1.3Ghz gear on order from the RMRC boys but they've been backorder/waiting on inventory for the 400mw 1.3Ghz vTX for quite some time now. Almost certainly not going to get it before this trip. :( So without that 1.3Ghz video gear, I'm not going to be flying too far away anyway.


With that said, it would be good to get some advice for this newbie as to how comfortable you guys might be for the following situation...


- I'm sitting on the shoreline at the laguna madre
- Flying my penguin out across the water (no serious obstacles)
- Using my ezUHF tx/rx
- Using my fatshark 200mw 5.8ghz vTX
- Using a 3-lobe (cloverleaf I think) bluebeam on the vTX
- I have a newly received 5.8Ghz pepperbox from Mashton that I can put on the goggles or I can put on another 3-lobe bluebeam cloverleaf on my goggles (Fatshark Attitudes SD)
- I do NOT have autopilot or Return-to-home capability on the plane


If you were me.... how far out over the water would you feel reasonably confident in going?

sgtsmall
8th March 2014, 04:15 PM
The classic statement of water ... "go as far as you are prepared to swim if you want the pieces"
However my only real comment is large water bodies and the beach can give you much better signal performance, excellent line of site, even the signal from your control tx hits salt water and deflects up beautifully.
Basically set yourself up for some early beach runs to get a feel for performance. Distance over water is mainly a psychological barrier, it just has more permanent consequences!
Antennas, the pepperbox should be better, however it's beamwidth may be a problem without a separate receiver/spotter. See how far you get with the cloverleaf.

mr_tucsons
9th March 2014, 04:09 AM
Hi all,
I just bought a fatshark predator v2 and at the first week it seem ok when I used it. Now it doesn't work, no display on the goggles ( black background with white horizontal line). On the AV transmitter, there still power connected small red led light when battery on.


Please help me.Do I need to replaced the AV transmitter??

IBCrazy
9th March 2014, 10:12 AM
Hi all,
I just bought a fatshark predator v2 and at the first week it seem ok when I used it. Now it doesn't work, no display on the goggles ( black background with white horizontal line). On the AV transmitter, there still power connected small red led light when battery on.


Please help me.Do I need to replaced the AV transmitter??

Be sure your batteries are fully charged and both are on the same channel. Then with the goggles on, plug in the transmitter. DO you see a change in the screen? If not, the transmitter is faulty. If there is a change in the screen, the camera is faulty.

-Alex

Flyswamper
9th March 2014, 10:24 AM
Hi guys... regarding powering a ground station.


If I have one of these...
http://aonomus.wordpress.com/2009/08/15/review-of-the-xantrex-xpower-powerpack-400-plus-motomaster-eliminator-600-powerbox/


and I am willing to drag/haul the thing to wherever I would setup a ground station, is there any reason you would not want to use something like this to power a whole range of potential ground station gizmos? Looking at the back of the Powerbox that I own, it lists the battery as 20 Ah. Would you be comfortable powering all the potential devices that might be on a ground station such as
- a pair of vRXs
- a diversity "box"
- a DVR
- a low-power 5.8Ghz vTX used as as repeater to goggles
- maybe an antenna tracker and servos?
- perhaps give power to an iphone/android or tablet receiving telemetry data?


I don't know that I'd actually have have all that stuff on my first groundstation (especially the antenna tracker and servos). But I am curious as to whether there is a reason that you wouldn't want to power any/all of those items from the lead acid battery driven system instead of the Lipos that I see most people seem to setup their ground stations with.

IBCrazy
9th March 2014, 10:32 AM
Hi guys... regarding powering a ground station.


If I have one of these...
http://aonomus.wordpress.com/2009/08/15/review-of-the-xantrex-xpower-powerpack-400-plus-motomaster-eliminator-600-powerbox/


and I am willing to drag/haul the thing to wherever I would setup a ground station, is there any reason you would not want to use something like this to power a whole range of potential ground station gizmos? Looking at the back of the Powerbox that I own, it lists the battery as 20 Ah. Would you be comfortable powering all the potential devices that might be on a ground station such as
- a pair of vRXs
- a diversity "box"
- a DVR
- a low-power 5.8Ghz vTX used as as repeater to goggles
- maybe an antenna tracker and servos?
- perhaps give power to an iphone/android or tablet receiving telemetry data?


I don't know that I'd actually have have all that stuff on my first groundstation (especially the antenna tracker and servos). But I am curious as to whether there is a reason that you wouldn't want to power any/all of those items from the lead acid battery driven system instead of the Lipos that I see most people seem to setup their ground stations with.
I single 3 cell 4000 mAh battery and a simle volt meter is what I would use. I get 3+ hours of flight time on my station with 4000 mAh capacity.

-Alex

Flyswamper
10th March 2014, 08:57 AM
Thanks. From that I am guessing that there is no technical reason my Powerbox wouldn't work. But..... you are pointing out to me that its rather silly to lug it around instead of just a 3S-4000mAH Lipo (or similar sized lipo). One thing that was going through my head about the powerbox is that it might serve as a decent "sand bag" for a tripod. The powerbox has a handle that I could tie a string/bungee-cord around and tie the other end to centreline hook of a tripod and serve as anchor. Then again, being a newbie to all this, I'm not sure how necessary that will be. Especially considering that I've only flow with 5.8Ghz so far and haven't built a ground station yet (unless you call a bundle of wires hanging off my goggles connecting to a DVR a ground station. :)

mr_tucsons
10th March 2014, 09:33 AM
Thanks Alex. I just did the troubleshooting of my fpv system from your suggested solution. For the result, my battery fully charge, when set goggle on as well as transmitter, there a change in the screen of the goggle. That means my camera is faulty. Currently im using Fatshark 600TVL.
One question I want to ask;


For the screen cable, it goes to ground terminal(-ve) black wire. Can I share this ground terminal with other ground -ve wire?? What I mean is paralleling the -ve camera with OSD main board -ve wire.(AEO Apache OSD)

gondoflier
26th March 2014, 02:46 PM
I have a Spektrum DX7 ( the older version, not the DX7s ). I'm flying my quad FPV with 1.3ghz 800mw tx and am waiting for my low pass filter to arrive because I understand this combination can reduce the range of my Sprektrum. I would like to be able to fly safely max 2km away. Do you think moving to Taranis I would be getting that, or I have to think about Ezuhf or something like that? What would be the best investment to make at this point? ..thanks :) ( IBCrazy, sorry if I'm spamming your threads with the same question ;) )

LVNeptune
26th March 2014, 02:51 PM
You want UHF when using 1.3...2.4 will be reduced NO MATTER WHAT.


Also 800mW might be too much and might cause interference with other components. 300mW would be the sweet spot and with a mad mushroom, clover, or skew and a nice directional CP antenna you can easily get 2km+

btown2
26th March 2014, 03:03 PM
I have a Spektrum DX7 ( the older version, not the DX7s ). I'm flying my quad FPV with 1.3ghz 800mw tx and am waiting for my low pass filter to arrive because I understand this combination can reduce the range of my Sprektrum. I would like to be able to fly safely max 2km away. Do you think moving to Taranis I would be getting that, or I have to think about Ezuhf or something like that? What would be the best investment to make at this point? ..thanks :) ( IBCrazy, sorry if I'm spamming your threads with the same question ;) )

Why do you need an 800 mw vtx?

gondoflier
26th March 2014, 04:07 PM
Some vendor told me it was a good system when I was looking for a long range FPV vtx..actually he told 1000mw with low pass filter. I'm realizing that it might have not been a good idea ?

HF_ATL
26th March 2014, 04:12 PM
Well... do you need let say more than 100km?
111km done with the standard fox 800mw vtx: http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1730566

gondoflier
26th March 2014, 04:21 PM
I really don't need more than a safe 2km..I have this with a mushroom antenna ( in the description it says up to 1.6kkm ) http://shop.righthere.nu/fpv-transmitters/fox-900mhz-0-9ghz-800mw-transmitter-for-fpv/prod_1092.html

LVNeptune
26th March 2014, 05:02 PM
With a good directional CP antenna and 300mW you will be fine for miles.

Radius
30th March 2014, 07:55 PM
Hi guys, figured I may as well post here as my question doesn't really need an entire thread...

Went out for my first lot of FPV flights this weekend, it was awesome.
I had limited setup time before heading out so I literally velcroe'd/zip tied everything in place on the plane with what cables I had in the kits.

The video system worked perfectly although being a new fpv'er I only flew about 620m away just in case.

My question is- what is the ideal rc/video antenna placement on my plane (bixler)?
I understand that the control and video antenna need to be as far away from each other as possible. What are other interference factors on the plane? ESC? Motor?
Here is a(n embarrassing) picture of my rough, "get it ready for the weekend" setup. EzUHF diversity RX in the nose.
Cheers
43913

OhmEye
30th March 2014, 07:56 PM
Vendor range specs as specific as 1.6km mean they are pulling numbers out of the air. There are a lot of factors that impact range and it's not like you an specify a precise distance. The local noise floor, antennas, and especially the receiver you use have a huge effect on range. One person in one location with one set of gear on one particular aircraft at a certain altitude might get 1.6km on that day. Without a lot of detailed info that number is not really useful.

And if it's an antenna spec, it's pure fantasy. You can't specify a distance range just for an antenna.

Flyswamper
11th April 2014, 09:17 AM
HI guys,

Have another newbie question, figured this was an appropriate thread to put it in.

I'm trying to *eventually* graduate from newbie status (who am I kidding, I will always be a newbie :) ) and in doing so I've now got myself a Taranis radio. I've had no troubles getting my ezUHF tx and rx working with it. Now I'm starting to wonder about whether I could use my Taranis with my parkflyer planes that have Spektrum receivers in them. I own a few too many radios now (a couple of Spektrum DX4s, a DX5, and a DX9).

I've searched/skimmed posts and threads just enough to give me the idea that there probably is some JR-style plugin module that can be put in my Taranis which would allow me to bind and fly my planes which have Spektrum receivers in them (SuperCubs, Apprentice, some homebuilt wings and an F22 that have spektrum receivers I bought a while ago, etc...).

What I would most benefit from is just a short/brief overview type of explanation of whether or not it can be done and maybe some specific terms/names that I can use for more targeted searching and additional reading. Thanks!

papabatman
15th April 2014, 01:55 PM
antenna question. could some one give me a good link to read about antennas. i have only flown linear polarized antennas, i have had great success 3 miles out and back, limited by my battery. now i have a deep reaper with a lot better range. my goal is about 5 miles out checking out rocks, mountains and some cloud surfing, got a inverted V on the plane and a biquad on the ground.

SurveilZone
15th April 2014, 02:09 PM
antenna question. could some one give me a good link to read about antennas. i have only flown linear polarized antennas, i have had great success 3 miles out and back, limited by my battery. now i have a deep reaper with a lot better range. my goal is about 5 miles out checking out rocks, mountains and some cloud surfing, got a inverted V on the plane and a biquad on the ground.



Recommen the 5.8Ghz 14dbi Ultra-light Rx Panel Antenna
http://www.surveilzone.com/5.8ghz-14dbi-fixed-wing-multirotor-vtx-panel-antenna-pa1184
http://www.surveilzone.com/images/FPV/FPV-antenna/PA1184/Best-5.8Ghz-FPV-Panel-Antenna.jpg

Or you can choose other antenna here:
http://www.surveilzone.com/fpv/fpv-antenna

jsoven
15th April 2014, 02:18 PM
So i'm going to apologize for all my possible spelling mistakes and noob questions. So i've been flying a s**t ton for about 6 months now on my Apprentice S 15E(currently on floats and i can fly in my backyard lake). I believe that i'm finally going to invest in fpv equipment. I would like to throw some fpv gear onto my apprentice as a starting point and get some experience under my belt before moving on to a better plane and gear. I would like to start off with a 1.2ghz setup as for the main fact that i live in a very "noisy" area and i have no exact clue as to where i will be flying so i don't have a positive fact that i will have line of site. I went down to the local hobby shop (graves rc) and the guys which i've been in contact with a lot said a great idea would be the new fatshark teleporters which is an all in one kit since I'D PREFER A SETUP WITH GOGGLES. I've looked at this and it's definitely a 5.8ghz kit. if anyone could give alternatives and suggestions for a system i'm open to ideas . Also to get good range i would assume i need to upgrade antennas. What would be a good antenna choice? And finally, the subject i know the least about in terms of options is radios. Currently i have the Spektrum dx5e transmitter which came with the plane. Unfortunately it runs off of 2.4 ghz which i realize would not be compatible with 1.2ghz video frequency and just in general won't be adequate for fpv flying. does anyone have suggestions on alternatives compatible with 1.2ghz?

papabatman
15th April 2014, 03:09 PM
SurveilZone (http://fpvlab.com/forums/member.php?11990-SurveilZone) i like your store. i have your camera on my planes. i also tried your clover leafs as well, but i am just to ruff for them. i should also note i fly 900mhz -1280mhz what i would like to see from your store is a good inexpensive diversity unit in the above range, and some yagi antennas too

Flyswamper
15th April 2014, 03:55 PM
I'D PREFER A SETUP WITH GOGGLES.
I'm too much of a newbie at this to be giving advice as to what it best, but as someone that has just went through a similar process I have found that in my earliest days of FPV flying that I really needed and LCD monitor. The reason is that I find I'm doing an awful lot of debugging/setting-up/testing while flying really close in and where I do 90% of the flight as just Line-of-sight flying. What I have done is fly LOS to get it up several mistakes high, then I will mess around with the FPV related setup and a wee bit of flying through the video. I found doing this by pulling goggles up/down to be pretty hard. With the goggles down (and being new at this) it's really hard to pull the goggles up and find your plane in the sky quickly.

Having a trusted spotter (i.e. one that doesn't get distracted and lose track of your plane even though it's still close...like one of my kids has done.. :) ) certainly would help with the goggles situation. I actually bought a pair of goggles as my first bit of fpv gear (got the Fatshark Attitudes). And I flew with them a little bit. But I quicklyi realized that I also wanted an LCD-groundstation. Certainly it's more bulk and I hope that someday this will all be 2nd-nature and I will be fine with just my goggles and integrated vRX. But for now, I really like being able to glance at the LCD screen as I mess with controls and see how the OSD reacts on the ground...all the while being able to hold and look at the plane and my radio at the same time.

Anyway.... I've rambled on long enough.... all the old pro's here recommend goggles and I can see that I'm going to graduate to that. But for me... I think I needed to start with LCD monitor. Something to consider...


I've looked at this and it's definitely a 5.8ghz kit. if anyone could give alternatives and suggestions for a system i'm open to ideas . Also to get good range i would assume i need to upgrade antennas.
From what I've read you want something that is circularly polarized. I think something like these are a decent start
http://www.readymaderc.com/store/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=11_45_49_97&products_id=1255




What would be a good antenna choice? And finally, the subject i know the least about in terms of options is radios. Currently i have the Spektrum dx5e transmitter which came with the plane. Unfortunately it runs off of 2.4 ghz which i realize would not be compatible with 1.2ghz video frequency and just in general won't be adequate for fpv flying. does anyone have suggestions on alternatives compatible with 1.2ghz?
I'm the owner of several DX4s, a DX5e (came with my apprentice), and I even bought the Spektrum DX9 about 5 months ago. But...if I were doing it over again and knew then what I now know... I'd have gone straight for my most recently purchased radio.. The Taranis.

Keep in mind that all my comments are one newbie giving feedback to another... :) It's just that your situation sounds so amazingly similar to where I was at roughly 6months to a year ago. Heck...I even have a mini-lake behind me that I've flow my Apprentice off floats on quite a bit.. :)
http://youtu.be/NoKw_5yKKpc

smoothvirus
15th April 2014, 04:05 PM
I've searched/skimmed posts and threads just enough to give me the idea that there probably is some JR-style plugin module that can be put in my Taranis which would allow me to bind and fly my planes which have Spektrum receivers in them (SuperCubs, Apprentice, some homebuilt wings and an F22 that have spektrum receivers I bought a while ago, etc...).

I believe this is what you're looking for. :)

http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/__24656__OrangeRX_DSMX_DSM2_2_4Ghz_Transmitter_Mod ule_JR_Turnigy_compatible_.html

Flyswamper
16th April 2014, 01:51 PM
I believe this is what you're looking for. :)

http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/__24656__OrangeRX_DSMX_DSM2_2_4Ghz_Transmitter_Mod ule_JR_Turnigy_compatible_.html

Thanks for help! I've seen that before, but I've always been a wee bit concerned that I'm interpreting the description/specifications correctly. Just been a wee bit worried that even though it's DSMX/DSM2 compatible that there might be some "gotcha" that would prevent it from being used with the stock Spektrum receivers that came in some of my RTF/BNF planes that I got early on like the Apprentice S15E (with the SAFE AS3X) and the Delta Ray (also with SAFE AS3X). I'd like to keep the existing "SAFE" receivers in those planes as they make it really nice to be able to hand control of the plane off to people that haven't flow before.

Now if I can figure out whether (and how to) my Taranis can do a wireless buddy box setup like the DX9 does... I might just be ready to sell my DX9. I think I read somewhere that wireless buddy is possible with Taranis but I haven't really pursued it since I don't really have the gear/modules yet for it to make any sense for me.

gondoflier
25th April 2014, 08:08 PM
Can anyone recommend a good LC filter? I was trying to get one at HKing but seems never to be in stock, and I'm not sure if it's good.

LVNeptune
25th April 2014, 11:58 PM
Don't use 1.3 video and 2.4 rc...It's a bad recipe.

gondoflier
26th April 2014, 07:54 AM
not even with a low pass filter ?

LVNeptune
26th April 2014, 10:08 AM
Correct. If you don't mind doing circles around yourself it's fine, otherwise if you want any real distance it just won't do.

gondoflier
26th April 2014, 07:36 PM
so whats the best option?..what do you recommend ?

LVNeptune
26th April 2014, 09:02 PM
2.4 and 5.8. 433 and 900/1.2/1.3/2.4

palcuz
3rd May 2014, 11:36 AM
Hello- please excuse my noobness....Last year I was able to build a tri copter with plans and help from many experienced pilots. Many thanks!

My question about fpv and video transmission :

Some have said be careful or don't use 5.8 ghz trans frequency because of interference and loss of control issues. Can somebody enlighten me ?

Also-I am building a quad copter now (HK 450) and hope to fly a camera such as a gopro or clone. I am not sure if I should go with a different frame such as the HK HAL if I am using an underside gimble....

shadowolf
3rd May 2014, 01:08 PM
5.8 is fine if you don't plan on flying behind objects, mountains, buildings etc. It you do tge video will most likely drop out.
I fly 5.8 and have been 2.5km and many others have gone further.
As far as loss of control. If you get a high power tx and place it next to the control rx you would have problems but get as much space between the vtx and crx as possible. More offten than not the 2.4 ghz control will effect your video than the 5.8 effect your control.
Hope this helps...

palcuz
3rd May 2014, 09:58 PM
5.8 is fine if you don't plan on flying behind objects, mountains, buildings etc. It you do tge video will most likely drop out.
I fly 5.8 and have been 2.5km and many others have gone further.
As far as loss of control. If you get a high power tx and place it next to the control rx you would have problems but get as much space between the vtx and crx as possible. More offten than not the 2.4 ghz control will effect your video than the 5.8 effect your control.
Hope this helps...

Thanks shadowwolf. Are you recording video? If so which frame config do you use? Gimble etc. ?